Editing Tips

Edgar A. · Dec 20, 2014

Hello, AWers,

So, I'm just about finished with a story that I'm been pecking at for... nearly two years now. There are a few things I want to fix and maybe a scene or two to add, and then I'll call it done.

Of course, after that comes the editing.

I was wondering if you wise old fellows had any tips? Beyond, of course, the old "re-read it and fix the grammar" bit. I figured that one a while ago.

Keep warm, stay cool,
Edgar A.

Maryn · Dec 20, 2014

Edgar, I'm happy to help with the things I attempt to do to my own work before letting anyone else see it.

Seek and destroy filtering. (Use the Google custom search box on the lower left of every AW page to look that up, if you need to. Much better than the search up top.)
Double check for consistency in character names--in my last one, Jemma suddenly became Jenna until I happened to see what was actually there.
Make sure the verb tenses are all the same, and confirm I've done flashbacks and backstory one tense back in the transitions, then matched the tense used in the rest.
Identify the verbs in sentences as I read, and see if they can be replaced by better ones. Which leads to...
Seeking and deleting adverbs in favor of stronger verbs which don't need propping up. Why have a guy eat quickly and leave immediately when he can gobble and dash? When you look for adverbs, start with all words ending in -ly, then move on to very, much, more, somewhat, somehow, quite, rather, in fact, just, even, and other favorites. It's not that you cannot use them, but they should need to be there.
Ensure the only italics used are ones which affect how the sentence is comprehended. It does not matter if the reader "hears" it as I do, if it makes the same sense. Often sarcasm requires italics, or the person seems mean or stupid.
Look for a mix of sentence structures and revise when I see too many are alike.
Make sure I'm not starting paragraph after paragraph with the same word.
Knowing my favorite words, ensure I'm not overusing them. Murmur sneaks into my work far too often.
Make sure each scene happens in a place rather than a featureless white box. I don't need a lot of description, but some is vital.
Find ways to ensure I engage all five senses of the POV character rather than only sight and hearing.
Confirm with a current online dictionary that my joining and hyphenation of compounds complies with their listing. When a word has two correct spellings, make sure I use the one listed first unless there's a reason not to.
Run grammar check, even though I know it's flawed. Each "mistake" it identifies, double check that it's correct as written, or fix it.
Run spell check--always the very last thing.

That's not even a complete list. I don't use a literal checklist, but this'll keep you busy for a while.

Maryn, whose work always needs more edits

field19 · Dec 20, 2014

Editing--flashback tense clarification

Could you give an example of how to transition to and from flashbacks, starting from the third person?

Does the flashback tense turn in to present tense, such as "He sees" or "She walks"?

Chase · Dec 20, 2014

Edgar A. said:
So, I'm ~~just~~ about finished with a story that I'm been pecking at for... nearly two years ~~now~~.

1. When beginning sentences with any of the seven coordinating conjunctions (and, or, nor, but, for, yet, so), try not to follow with a comma. That punctuation is for leading adverbs, such as however, then, also, consequently, etc.

2. As Maryn suggested, get rid of overused pet words.

3. Many publishers edit by the five rules for necessary commas:

For U.S. publications, five rules explain necessary commas. A few other commas are optional, but the majority are superfluous—excessive, pointless, unnecessary.

Comma Rule Number 1: A comma is necessary to separate a compound structure, two or more main clauses joined by one of the seven coordinating conjunctions: and, or, nor, but, for, yet, so.
The woman drank black coffee, and she ate a croissant.
You can conduct yourself in a pleasant manner, or you can be horrible.
Evan loves Suzanne, but he cannot forget Elena.

If a writer chooses to make those constructions into simple sentences, then the comma is not used:
The woman drank black coffee and ate a croissant.
You can conduct yourself in a pleasant manner or be horrible.
Evan loves Suzanne but cannot forget Elena.

Comma Rule Number 2: A comma is necessary to separate a long introductory element before a main clause. Rule 2 holds true for both simple and complex constructions:

Even though ignorant of our culture, we must always be kind to strangers. (Simple)
Since Constance is new to our company, all of us should strive to help her. (Complex)

It’s always correct to set off any introductory element with a comma, but a more modern lean toward fewer commas in novels has made the practice optional for shorter elements. Either is acceptable:
Later, you can join us for dessert.
Later you can join us for dessert.

Comma Rule Number 3: Commas separate items in a series:
James found blondes attractive, redheads adorable, and brunettes irresistible.

The final comma before the conjunction is always correct. However, the journalistic practice to omit the serial (or Oxford) comma is every author’s option:
James found blondes attractive, redheads adorable and brunettes irresistible.

Also correct is an occasional asyndeton, the intentional omission of the normally occurring conjunction (and, or, but, for, nor, so, yet) in a series of words, phrases, or clauses:
James found blondes attractive, redheads adorable, brunettes irresistible.

Comma Rule Number 4: Interjections and forms of address are set off with commas.
Yes, I will accompany you to the ball.
No, I won’t!
You, sir, are out of line.
You may be assured, ma’am, of our concern.
Are you certain of that prognosis, Doctor?
Thank you, Mother, for all you do.

There’s a world of difference between “Let’s eat, Grandpa” and “Let’s eat Grandpa.”

Comma Rule Number 5: Words, phrases, or clauses (appositives and infinitives included) which interrupt the main clause must be set off with commas fore and aft. The rule includes the state following the name of a city and the year following the day of the month.
Mrs. Ellen Bennet, my mother, is in the drawing room.
The Brooklyn Bridge, as opposed to this matchstick construction, is sturdy and reliable.
He was born on June 23, 1941, Big Timber, Montana, along the Yellowstone River.
Those earrings, in my opinion, would look better hanging over formal dining tables.

5A. The final necessary use of the comma is the most difficult for many writers. It’s actually the same as rule 5, but it’s often presented in isolation because of its difficulty. As with appositives and infinitive phrases, it separates nonrestrictive clauses in a sentence. The nonrestrictive clause is not essential to the sentence. It merely adds information:
Abraham Lincoln, who was the tallest of U.S. presidents, was an imposing figure of a man.
The grizzly, a bear misunderstood by tourists, is named Ursus horribilis for good reason.

By contrast, a restrictive clause is essential to the sentence:
The lady who cried is my mother.
The man who shot Liberty Valance became a state senator.

whiporee · Dec 20, 2014

Print it out. Double spaced, 12-point courier. Take away anything pretty and just leave your words.

Then bring out a red pencil or pen and be as brutal as you can be. Then get ready to do it again.

Have fun.

Old Hack · Dec 20, 2014

Most of the comments so far deal with small stuff. That should really be last on your list.

Work from big to small.

Make sure the plot and story really hold together before you do anything else. Then look at your structure.

Strengthen your characterisation, your settings.

Then work on your dialogue, your descriptions.

Correct any obvious typos you encounter along the way but don't go hunting them down until you've dealt with the big stuff, detailed above.

Once you've got it all tight and lovely, leave it alone for a week or two. Then get to work on your grammar and punctuation and your adverbs and your other little stuff. Then leave it for another week or month or however long you can, and read it through again. At this point try reading it aloud to a trusted friend; read it backwards, a page at a time, which will help you find errors you've missed before.

Chasing the Horizon · Dec 20, 2014

Every writer will probably answer this question differently because we all have different weaknesses that we need to correct in editing. Learning what mistakes you tend to make is a big part of improving your writing.

I know I have to tighten my descriptions when I edit because I tend to go into way too much detail, and that I often need to add character feelings because emotion is just not my strong suit in any aspect of life, including writing. I always come across a handful of scenes which malfunctioned in some way and have to be structurally fixed, usually things I wrote out that should've been summarized and scenes where I ended up with blobs of different elements instead of mixing them together properly. Then there's all the awkward phrasing since I don't edit at all as I write.

I do it all as a single pass, from beginning to end. If I have to make significant changes to a scene, I do it and then immediately go back to the top of the scene and do line edits. I write out of order, so doing it this way lets me catch the inconsistencies and redundancies better. I then give the manuscript to a couple of beta readers and let them do the final copy edits because I'm aware that I'm abysmal at copy editing and grammar.

CathleenT · Dec 20, 2014

It's hard to contribute much after the excellent earlier posts. I will add that I usually go through my work with an eye to Allen Guthrie's sticky at the top of this forum. If you haven't checked out the pleonasm paper already, I highly recommend it.

Maryn · Dec 20, 2014

field19 said:
Could you give an example of how to transition to and from flashbacks, starting from the third person?

Does the flashback tense turn in to present tense, such as "He sees" or "She walks"?

I can try. I'm writing this off the cuff, so bear with me. I'll italicize the verbs and underline the ones that illustrate.

Jenna's back ached. She had bent over the dining room table cutting the fabric for her prom dress for nearly two hours. The pattern's label read "quick and easy" and lured buyers with "Make it tonight." So far, sewing her own formal dress sucked. Finished cutting at last, she pressed her hand to her back and stood, nearly knocking over the pins at the edge of the table. [Note that this is third person, past tense, as the story's current time. There's one use of past-perfect tense, she had bent, indicating something that occurred in the story's past. All the verbs but that one are past tense.]

Jordan had invited her only a week before the prom. Jenna suspected his date had changed her mind. Nevertheless, Jenna floated through the rest of the school day. She took the bus to FabricWorld, where a friendly woman her grandmother's age assured her the pattern looked easy enough for a beginner. [The transition to what happened the week before is past perfect tense. Once we're there, the rest of the flashback paragraph is in past tense, same as what's currently going on in the story.]

The cutting alone took more than the time allotted by "Make it tonight." She stayed up way past her usual bedtime pinning the pieces together. [Now we're back in the story's present, which is told in past tense.]

Did that make sense?

Maryn, senseless

Jamesaritchie · Dec 20, 2014

Just want to emphasize what Old Hack said. If you start small and work to big, you'll have to do the small all over again. If you start big and work down to smallest, it's a one pass technique.

As fro the rest, I've learned not to sweat it. I've found that if a sentence says what I want it to say, and if it sounds good, it is good. If I handle content and sound, all the minutia falls in line without effort.

Maryn · Dec 20, 2014

Amen to James's endorsement of Old Hack's wisdom. There's a time for the tips I gave, but later.

Maryn, half way into a Honey Brown lager

VoireyLinger · Dec 20, 2014

Seconding... wait thirding... *counts* Fourthing the advice to work from big to small. Incidentally, that's also how I taught my kids to clean their rooms. Get the big things out of the way and save the small stuff for the final cleanup.

When I started editing, the biggest problem I had was trying to figure out exactly what I was supposed to be doing. I knew there was more than fixing typos and moving commas, but I didn't know what I ought to be looking for. Because it's long, I won't repost it here, but I did write a blog outlining some of the basics. This is a beginner's list, something to get you started, and for a first-time editor, it will probably get you through several rounds.

dawinsor · Dec 20, 2014

Two of my favorite posts about editing. The first one is from Justine Larbalestier:

http://justinelarbalestier.com/blog/2008/01/02/how-to-rewrite/

The second is from Holly Lisle:

http://hollylisle.com/one-pass-manuscript-revision-from-first-draft-to-last-in-one-cycle/

Orianna2000 · Dec 20, 2014

When I'm revising, I tend to read a book on a particular subject, like dialogue, or characterization, or description, or plots, and then I'll go through my manuscript to apply everything I've just learned. Not only does it help improve my writing, but it cements the new skills in my mind (by practicing them), so next time, I can apply those techniques as I'm writing, thereby saving myself a revision pass.

While there are specific things that every writer needs to watch for, you're also going to find personal ticks, things you do every time, which need to be corrected. No one can tell you what these are, unless they've read your work. It's generally something you have to figure out for yourself.

For example, my first drafts tend to be worded very formally, with no contractions and lots of fancy words, which makes me sound a bit stuck up. It's how I naturally write, but it doesn't sound natural, so I have to go through and remove the fancier words, and add some contractions, to make my writer's voice sound more relaxed. I also overuse punctuation, so I have to go through and edit out the excess commas, exclamation points, em-dashes, and ellipses.

There will also be words that you tend to overuse, because you like them, or because they're familiar. You'll need to make a list of whatever words you personally overuse, so you can weed them out in revisions.

Here's some books you might find useful:

Lizzie7800 · Dec 20, 2014

I followed a lot of the advice I found on this site (remove -ly words, just, -ing words...etc) on my manuscript. Then passed it along to my dad (I know I'm lucky to have a real editor in my family) who agreed to do the final edit. He wanted me to do as much as I could before he took it on, since he's doing it for free he still has his day job.

He was surprised at how little he has to do. So there's a lot of great people on here with great tips.

K.S. Crooks · Dec 20, 2014

Nicely done, finishing your novel. Editing can be a daunting task. Take it slow and limit the amount you do each day otherwise you will fail to see what you need to change.
I like to do a first edit of a chapter when I finish writing it, as I find doing everything at the end painful. The same principle applies regardless of when you edit.
1st I do a run through of the story making sense, things are stated or restated correctly.
The 2nd thing I like to do is a search for particular words that I overstate or misuse: but (and its synonyms), that, which, just
3rd I read the story out-loud on the computer, with the focus on punctuation and flow.

I do steps 1-3 while I am still writing the book. When it is finished I do the following.

4th Read through the entire story looking for any errors or things I decide to change.
5th Print the story and read out-loud, as a reader.
6th give copies to other people to read. At this point a person tends to see what they meant to write, regardless of what is actually there.
7th You may choose to have a professional edit your story. I have friend who is a retired English teacher that has written her own books. Check with people you know to find someone qualified who is willing to do it for little cost.

Steps 5 and 6 are the real key ones to make your story flow and have minimal mistakes.
Hope this helps.

BethS · Dec 21, 2014

field19 said:
Could you give an example of how to transition to and from flashbacks, starting from the third person?

Does the flashback tense turn in to present tense, such as "He sees" or "She walks"?

Are you writing the rest of the story in present tense?

If so, then the flashback scene would likely be written in the same tense. It's just another scene, except that it takes place in the story's past.

As for transitions, just make it clear when you're moving into and out of a flashback. One technique that works is to use a "gate." For a fairly obvious and common example, a character comes across a photo in a drawer that triggers the flashback scene. The story returns to the present with the character still looking at the photograph. The gate can be more subtle than that, obviously; the idea is that you leave the story and return through the same place.

Jamesaritchie · Dec 21, 2014

Lizzie7800 said:
I followed a lot of the advice I found on this site (remove -ly words, just, -ing words...etc) on my manuscript. .

I hope you don't remove all of them. There's nothing wrong with ly words, ing words, just, or pretty much anything else. They're perfectly good words. Narrative and dialogue can sound unnatural with them because we all use them in daily life.

Keep them under control, but don't remove them all just because some writing advice says to do so.

jjdebenedictis · Dec 21, 2014

I don't theeenk anyone else has mentioned this, but you can delete "that" from a lot of sentences and the meaning of sentence remains the same. E.g.

"I see that you have made a friend."
"I see you have made a friend."

This falls under the "Omit needless words" banner. A higher content-to-waffle-words ratio in your prose tends to make the reading more engaging.

LJD · Dec 21, 2014

I like this book: Self-Editing for Fiction Writers (Renni Browne, David King)
Also not bad: Revision & Self-Editing (James Scott Bell)
If you're feeling a little lost now, you might check those out.

Debbie V · Dec 23, 2014

Watch out for words that telegraph - "Jody was about to have a moment she'd never forget." This tells what will be shown in the next few sentences. "Suddenly" creates a pause that makes the events that follow less sudden.

Also, make sure every detail you include is one that the reader needs to know and is included at a point where the reader needs to know it. This keeps you from front loading back story.

When you've gone as far as you can on your own, find a critique group or partner or post in SYW. Just keep in mind that it's still your work and you have the final say. This step always helps me focus on why I did something the way I did. Once I know that for sure, I know if it works and what needs to be done to make it work if it doesn't.

I think everyone else has covered the rest.

pyrosama · Dec 23, 2014

Edgar A. said:
I was wondering if you wise old fellows had any tips? Beyond, of course, the old "re-read it and fix the grammar" bit. I figured that one a while ago.

Keep warm, stay cool,
Edgar A.

I use MS Word, so my first round of edits are quick scans for repeating patterns.

smh1024 · Dec 23, 2014

One thing I do is read through the story with the whole "show don't tell" mantra in mind. I pick out words that could mean different things to different people then try to define them better using the five senses.

Unfortunately, I can't think of a *GREAT* example of what I mean right now. :Shrug:

But a basic example would be:

Jane was surprised.

vs.

Jane jumped up and down, screeching in disbelief.

I think doing this can give your characters more personality. You are showing how they specifically react to their world. It also gives the story a voice that only you can give it.

Lizzie7800 · Dec 25, 2014

Jamesaritchie said:
I hope you don't remove all of them. There's nothing wrong with ly words, ing words, just, or pretty much anything else. They're perfectly good words. Narrative and dialogue can sound unnatural with them because we all use them in daily life.

Keep them under control, but don't remove them all just because some writing advice says to do so.

No, not all of them. I did a search though and had 1800 -ly words. Before I found this site I had no clue what to look for. I took several days and analyzed each one to see if I could replace it with a stronger verb. With many of them I was able to. There are still a few in there though.

Once! · Dec 26, 2014

Seconding - (thirding or fourthing?) Old Hack. Edit from big to small. Plot holes and structure first. Nit picking later.

I have this mental image that editing is like panning for gold on an industrial scale. You start with a pile of dreck which may or may not have some flecks of gold in it.

You then apply several different processes to this pile. A coarse filter to weed out the big rocks. An acid wash to ... heck, I don't know ... do whatever acid washes do. A medium filter. Washing with water. A fine filter.

Each stage removes some more of the dreck and gets us closer to the gold. There is no one stage that takes us from dreck to gold.

I see editing as a multi-stage process. I make several passes through the document looking for specific things. This will eventually include searching for individual words and phrases with ctrl-F. Or reading only those parts of the novel which contain a specific character to make sure that I've been consistent with that character.

Editing Tips

At Sea

DreamSeeker

It Takes All of Us to End Racism

Such a nasty woman

Blowing in the Wind

I write

At Sea

At Sea

Angel Wing Fetish

Dorothy A. Winsor

Freelance Writer

is watching you via her avatar

Mentoring Myself and Others

Pyrosama

Still confused by shoelaces