Facebook want you to use your real name - or do they just want you to set up a page?

nkkingston · Sep 16, 2014

Facebook is on another of it's anti-anonymous campaigns again. It's determined that everyone should use their real name to prevent bullies hiding behind pseudonyms. The question is, of course, how facebook knows what your real name is.

My initial speculation was that they'd go for people with unusual names, or punctuation in them, or non-roman characters. I figured maybe people who changed their name might get hit. I wasn't expecting Kate Aaron's blog post - she does use her real name, it's a very normal name for her stated location, she hasn't changed it... but she does use a profile for business.

What facebook wants is to force people using profiles for business purposes to switch to pages, so they can charge them to boost posts and reach a fraction of their previous audience - e.g. performers, authors with pseudonyms, small businesses, etc. What facebook is doing, however, it hurting any user with a stalker, trans* users who aren't out, teachers who don't want their students to find them, people in jobs that might fire them for how they conduct their private lives, etc. In the name of preventing bullying, of course.

The trans and drag communities have already started a petition objecting to this change. I'm not convinced it'll do anything, since they're calling facebook out on this being a money thing rather than a bullying thing, which facebook aren't going to admit to any time soon.

So, yeah. If you use a profile to promote your work, whether you use a pseudonym or not, brace yourself to be suspended.

veinglory · Sep 16, 2014

The Facebook policy far predates and is not related to any "bullying" accusations as far as I can see. A few people seem to have been under a rock for quite a few years to not be familiar with the real name requirement for profiles (pen names are for pages). It seems to relate to statistics and anti-spamming.

ETA I looked it up, this requirement has been in their rules and EULA since 2008.

nkkingston · Sep 16, 2014

The requirement isn't new*, but the sudden enforcement is. Especially the complete absence of any justification of what makes facebook thinks certain names aren't 'real', and a bald demand to enter a different name or face the consequences.

*Nor is having more than one account, which seems to surprise people over and over and over.

veinglory · Sep 16, 2014

Enforcement is sporadic but definitely ongoing. I am boggled how many people mistook 'not being caught' for 'the rules don't exist'.

It is a very widely publicized requirement that has hit the national news many times such as earlier this year and it was protested by some drag performers.

ShaunHorton · Sep 16, 2014

Just goes to show why you should actually read the TOS for the websites you sign up for. So everyone can avoid sensationalist headlines and ignorance-based outrage when they get caught violating rules they weren't aware of because they checked the little box without reading or understanding what they were agreeing to.

Buffysquirrel · Sep 16, 2014

Absent any reliable method of ascertaining what people's real names are, FB can't enforce this in a reasonable fashion. I imagine that's what a lot of people think when they sign up with a pseudonym--how are FB ever going to prove it's not their real name? What others perhaps don't appreciate is the converse: how are they going to prove to FB it IS their real name?

I do find it annoying seeing FB shoot themselves in the foot again and again, viz their fascinating decision not to show us updates from the pages we've signed up to get updates from. If I didn't think I'd lose touch with some of my friends, I'd be long gone.

Polenth · Sep 16, 2014

nkkingston said:
My initial speculation was that they'd go for people with unusual names, or punctuation in them, or non-roman characters.

The rule is nothing new. What is new is they usually did go after people with unusual names. Or what Facebook decided was an unusual name, which generally meant a name that wouldn't be common among white Americans. And people convinced themselves it'd never happen to them, because they were called Mary or Fred, and maybe it was fault of those other people for having odd names (and in some cases, no photo ID to prove it was their name).

Much as I dislike the policy in general, I'm side-eyeing people who didn't see it as an issue until someone came after their name. I've been at risk of being suspended by Facebook (and anywhere with a 'real name' policy) since the start, but it was only when people with names like Mary and Fred faced suspension that it blew up.

So my overall reaction is, "Welcome to my world." I do hope they change the rules, and I understand why people in frequently-targeted groups are using this to help publicise the issues. But I wish it would have been taken seriously before, as it's been going on for years.

smalls · Sep 16, 2014

Buffysquirrel said:
Absent any reliable method of ascertaining what people's real names are, FB can't enforce this in a reasonable fashion. I imagine that's what a lot of people think when they sign up with a pseudonym--how are FB ever going to prove it's not their real name? What others perhaps don't appreciate is the converse: how are they going to prove to FB it IS their real name?

I do find it annoying seeing FB shoot themselves in the foot again and again, viz their fascinating decision not to show us updates from the pages we've signed up to get updates from. If I didn't think I'd lose touch with some of my friends, I'd be long gone.

From what I understand, users will need to upload a copy of identification (birth certificate, driver's license, passport, etc.) to verify their name:

https://www.facebook.com/help/contact/197295393639994

Yet another reason I'm glad I'm not on FB. I had a stalker about five years ago and I STILL don't feel comfortable using my real name anywhere online for fear of attracting his attention. If I hadn't deleted my FB back then, I'd surely have to now.

Jamesaritchie · Sep 16, 2014

smalls said:
From what I understand, users will need to upload a copy of identification (birth certificate, driver's license, passport, etc.) to verify their name:

https://www.facebook.com/help/contact/197295393639994

Yet another reason I'm glad I'm not on FB. I had a stalker about five years ago and I STILL don't feel comfortable using my real name anywhere online for fear of attracting his attention. If I hadn't deleted my FB back then, I'd surely have to now.

I didn't have to use any real Id to sign up, but I have no qualms about using my real name online. What difference does it make? Anyone who wants to know who you are can easily find out. For that matter, real name or not, you still get stalkers.

But Facebook has a policy it can't enforce, and doesn't even know who is or isn't real, for that matter.

veinglory · Sep 16, 2014

Like any low-staff website they enforce rule violations as they notice them, and at that point they require ID if you want to keep the 'suspect' account.

DancingMaenid · Sep 16, 2014

Jamesaritchie said:
I didn't have to use any real Id to sign up, but I have no qualms about using my real name online. What difference does it make? Anyone who wants to know who you are can easily find out. For that matter, real name or not, you still get stalkers.

People don't go by their legal names for all sorts of reasons. I go by my middle name instead of my first name simply because I prefer it, and because my middle name is more androgynous than my first name is. For all intents and purposes, my middle name is my real name.

But for the most part, I use pseudonyms online because I prefer it and I because I like to keep my online activities relatively separate from my "real" identity. I don't want to make it too easy for my employers to find out I write kinky erotica, for example.

I don't use Facebook for promotional purposes and wouldn't, but the only websites I put my full legal name on are sites that really need that info (like when I file my taxes).

Liosse de Velishaf · Sep 16, 2014

I really, really dislike this policy. It's actually aimed at creating salable user profiles for targeted marketing purposes, and has been since the beginning. Facebook in general has a habit of playing baiting games to create sunk cost so when they later add or more closely enforce terms of their EULA, users will be so invested they'll keep their profiles and change them to follow the new guidelines rather than leave. Social networking sites, most of which make their revenue off of selling user profiles and targeted advertising often engage in these tactics.

Some sites, such as Twitter, know that many internet users, including those desirous of being active on social media sites often prefer anonymity for a variety of reasons, most of them harmless and often respectable. They often provide a tool to "verify" an identity, using an opt-in approach.

I have many friends who only ever use pseudonyms online, or maintain pseudonymous profiles (possibly alongside their regular ones) for various reasons. No one I know of has ever been targeted by enforcement of this rule. I'm not surprised that now that Facebook has IPO'd and is really pushing their money-making strategies, including the nasty pay-to-play messaging system they tried to push a year or so back.

Requiring ID verification without good evidence for suspecting the account makes me incredibly uncomfortable I would very closely check the TOS for what they're allowed to do with verification data. It might be quite useful for a company engaging in selling user (read: customer) profile information.

JournoWriter · Sep 17, 2014

What facebook wants is to force people using profiles for business purposes to switch to pages, so they can charge them to boost posts and reach a fraction of their previous audience - e.g. performers, authors with pseudonyms, small businesses, etc.

I want to dive into this a little more for clarity's sake. So FB is not saying that you can't use a "business name"/pseudonym at all, but rather that you have to use it in conjunction with a Page account rather than a Personal profile (which should have your real name attached). I'm not sure what's wrong with that. Writers using pseudonyms can set up Pages and tell their fans to head over there. Personal profiles - friending someone - were never supposed to be used by businesses, to my recollection. Pages - liking something - are the appropriate outlet for that.

As far as the "reach"/selling ads thing goes, FB posts from a personal profile only reach a fraction of your friends at present; I'm not sure it's going to hurt much to use a Page vs. a Profile. The Page may actually assist businesses by providing more analytics about posts that are unavailable on personal profiles. So that's a plus.

As for the name issue, well, FB is free, and we've always known that it makes its money from selling our data and information about us to advertisers. Making sure that "Johnathan Superman" is a real person vs. a sockpuppet helps FB assure advertisers that its user numbers are real. Twitter has a huge fake account problem, and I assume FB is working hard to avoid that. This all seems reasonable to me.

I'm not sure how people with stalkers are affected by this, as long as they keep their privacy settings right and circle of friends trusted and tighter. The same for teachers and people with twitchy employers. Only friend actual friends, and don't broadcast to the world, and you're OK. If anyone can explain that issue more, I'm all ears - perhaps I don't have the proper frame of reference.

The trans/outing issue is indeed a problem, but I'm not sure how to deal with it - that's an area where the law and business practices in general need a big overhaul.

Drag performers can set up a business Page as well. I'm unclear how they're affected.

The bottom line is that this has always been the rule, and that there are still avenues to reach your audience. (Moving to a Page actually gives you more data on engagement. Right now, a profile user has no idea how many people are reading their posts.)

The takeaway for writers using pseudonyms may be not to put all your eggs in one basket - don't rely solely on one online platform to reach your audience. Have a Twitter account, a real website, and an email list in addition to FB, and promote them to your audience. That way when the Zuck Empire comes crashing down, your online identity doesn't go with it.

Buffysquirrel · Sep 17, 2014

smalls said:
From what I understand, users will need to upload a copy of identification (birth certificate, driver's license, passport, etc.) to verify their name:

https://www.facebook.com/help/contact/197295393639994

I suppose that might work in countries where governments issue ID. But I suspect it would still be relatively easy to fake or borrow something suitable.

Liosse de Velishaf · Sep 17, 2014

JournoWriter said:
I want to dive into this a little more for clarity's sake. So FB is not saying that you can't use a "business name"/pseudonym at all, but rather that you have to use it in conjunction with a Page account rather than a Personal profile (which should have your real name attached). I'm not sure what's wrong with that. Writers using pseudonyms can set up Pages and tell their fans to head over there. Personal profiles - friending someone - were never supposed to be used by businesses, to my recollection. Pages - liking something - are the appropriate outlet for that.

As far as the "reach"/selling ads thing goes, FB posts from a personal profile only reach a fraction of your friends at present; I'm not sure it's going to hurt much to use a Page vs. a Profile. The Page may actually assist businesses by providing more analytics about posts that are unavailable on personal profiles. So that's a plus.

As for the name issue, well, FB is free, and we've always known that it makes its money from selling our data and information about us to advertisers. Making sure that "Johnathan Superman" is a real person vs. a sockpuppet helps FB assure advertisers that its user numbers are real. Twitter has a huge fake account problem, and I assume FB is working hard to avoid that. This all seems reasonable to me.

I'm not sure how people with stalkers are affected by this, as long as they keep their privacy settings right and circle of friends trusted and tighter. The same for teachers and people with twitchy employers. Only friend actual friends, and don't broadcast to the world, and you're OK. If anyone can explain that issue more, I'm all ears - perhaps I don't have the proper frame of reference.

The trans/outing issue is indeed a problem, but I'm not sure how to deal with it - that's an area where the law and business practices in general need a big overhaul.

Drag performers can set up a business Page as well. I'm unclear how they're affected.

The bottom line is that this has always been the rule, and that there are still avenues to reach your audience. (Moving to a Page actually gives you more data on engagement. Right now, a profile user has no idea how many people are reading their posts.)

The takeaway for writers using pseudonyms may be not to put all your eggs in one basket - don't rely solely on one online platform to reach your audience. Have a Twitter account, a real website, and an email list in addition to FB, and promote them to your audience. That way when the Zuck Empire comes crashing down, your online identity doesn't go with it.

For one thing, sing a page is an automatic signal, "Hey, I'm using a fake name!" For some purposes, that's no big deal. For others, it's quite a bit of trouble.

Also, people didn't always know that Facebook was selling their data. I imagine if you survey your average Facebook user, they don't really know that either, or if they once found out, they've long since let it slip their mind. I don't think many people would sign a contract that said upfront: "I let you talk to your friends and posts pictures and plan events, and in exchange, you agree to let me mine your data for selling you to advertisers."

Certainly, Facebook only laid out in the vaguest of terms what they might do with people's profile data in their EULA. Then, once they had people really invested, they started really working the whole data selling thing. Some people might argue that relying on the ignorance of your users is smart business. I think it's scummy.

veinglory · Sep 17, 2014

Liosse de Velishaf said:
For one thing, sing a page is an automatic signal, "Hey, I'm using a fake name!" For some purposes, that's no big deal. For others, it's quite a bit of trouble.

Which tidily explains why they want their key service, profiles, not to suffer from that skepticism, surely?

They see their profiles as being easily trusted actual people, contacts unlikely to take part in spamming etc. They try to create that environment in the cheapest manner possible (i.e no exceptions, no manual checking, you have to prove identity on demand not routinely).

I don't have to love the approach to understand why it adds value to their product and is cost effective.

JournoWriter · Sep 17, 2014

I know several authors who use Pages and no one thinks they're using a fake name because of it. I'm not sure what you mean or why you insist that Pages are inferior to profiles.

As for general antipathy toward the TOS, well, lots of companies are selling your data or using your eyeballs as an audience for advertisers. Newspapers have been selling ad space for years. Magazines sell off their mailing lists. Amazon mines our buying habits. This is nothing new. The only new element is how quickly so many of us chose to share so much about ourselves with a private company.

Liosse de Velishaf · Sep 17, 2014

JournoWriter said:
I know several authors who use Pages and no one thinks they're using a fake name because of it. I'm not sure what you mean or why you insist that Pages are inferior to profiles.

As for general antipathy toward the TOS, well, lots of companies are selling your data or using your eyeballs as an audience for advertisers. Newspapers have been selling ad space for years. Magazines sell off their mailing lists. Amazon mines our buying habits. This is nothing new. The only new element is how quickly so many of us chose to share so much about ourselves with a private company.

I completely understand selling user profiles/your mailing list from a business standpoint. I see why it would be attractive, how you could make decent money off it, etc. I do think Facebook has been less than upfront in how it explains it's use of profile information for such a purpose. That's my complaint. Personally, the best social network in my ideal world would not be run by a private company like Facebook. At least not one that used it as a giant datamine. If such a network existed and had a majority of people I know on it, I would jump ship from Facebook immediately. I was incredibly hopeful about Google+ being this network, but it wasn't. I don't use my Facebook very much for that reason, but it's convenient to have one because everybody is on it. I don't shop at Amazon, for books, or anything else if I can avoid it. I don't subscribe to magazines that sell their subscription lists.

At least when I read a newspaper, I know exactly how it makes its money from ads. Same for web-based news. I do my best to disable the data-collecting software in my browser and on websites I visit. I have adblock. But I'd have to live under a rock to avoid all the various data-mining stuff that's integrated into modern life these days.

Buffysquirrel · Sep 17, 2014

My antipathy towards Pages is caused by a) FB not allowing me to see their updates and b) the difficulty in navigating to them to see the updates for yourself. I have to use FB Purity just to see what I've signed on to see.

Becky Black · Sep 18, 2014

Requiring a real name narks me more than them trying to get us to pay to boost our Page posts. I mean, that's advertising essentially and Facebook make money from selling advertising space, not giving it away for free. So, okay, fair enough. But of course that means loads of people like authors, performers, small charities and non-profits etc aren't going to be able to afford to pay, making their pages essentially pointless. So they'll close them, because what's the point in spending the time keeping them up?

And if they can't use a Profile instead as a way to interact with fans and followers, then those are useless as well. Basically Facebook don't want those people on Facebook. We don't make them any money. All they want is consumers (with real names, super valuable for data mining) and big brands who can afford to pay to boost their page posts. Which blends content with advertising and that's frankly, the devil.

If they enforce this one on me I'll have to just defriend all the writers I'm friends with and there's be no point in following their pages either as I can't interact on them with my pen name. I'll be following a few family members and real world friends.

Wilde_at_heart · Sep 18, 2014

If they think fake names are an issue, wait til they realise how many people use it to maintain a facade of a 'perfect' life and may appear wealthy but in reality are a one-percent interest rate hike away from insolvency ... One friend of mine rants constantly about how much BS her sister posts about herself and pulled her own profile because she grew fed up with the way so many people she knew misrepresented themselves.

Buffysquirrel · Sep 18, 2014

One of my friends has a profile that indicates she lives in Antarctica. I'm sceptical.

Liosse de Velishaf · Sep 18, 2014

The issue of being able to interact with other people as your page is actually an interesting point, I think. Is there a way to post on other pages or people's timelines with your Page name being your identity?

aruna · Sep 19, 2014

My personal Facebook profile is in my pen name. I have never been asked to verify it, and I couldn't.
My daughter's Fb is with a "wrong" surname, so she hasn't been asked to either. My son used to have the same "wrong" surname, and has used a totally made up name on FB -- never asked to verify.

Buffysquirrel · Sep 19, 2014

I use my real name but the only photo id I have is an out-of-date passport *shrugs*.

Facebook want you to use your real name - or do they just want you to set up a page?

nkkingston

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Facebook want you to use your real name - or do they just want you to set up a page?

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