Contract question.

muse · Apr 17, 2015

I have two questions and they’re biggies. I have a contract in my grubby hand but I’m wary about two aspects:

It looks like they’re asking for all rights, something I’m reluctant to do. Is there a polite way to refuse to grant all rights? (And which ones shouldn’t I give away?) The publisher will predominantly produce ebooks, with POD an option later. Does this make a difference in the granting of rights? (Yes, I really am that dumb.)

Second question and it’s linked to the first:

What does it mean when it says “To grant licenses to third parties to exploit any of the rights granted herein?”

From everything I’ve read this sounds like the first publisher can lease my copyright to someone else? And for a different term that agreed to by me? Is this standard?

I realise there won’t be any one simple answer to these questions, but any help you could provide would be welcome.

Thanks in advance

muse

Old Hack · Apr 17, 2015

If you're in a position to exploit foreign and subsidiary rights, hang on to them. If your publisher has a good record of selling those rights on and you have no way to sell them, then it might be better letting the publisher have them.

The contract clause reads to me as though it gives the publisher the right to sell rights on to other publishers and so on. But I am not good at contract law, so do not rely on me here.

Is there something similar to the Society of Authors in Ireland? The UK SoA gives excellent contract advice to its members, completely free. You might want to look into that.

muse · Apr 17, 2015

Old Hack said:
If you're in a position to exploit foreign and subsidiary rights, hang on to them. If your publisher has a good record of selling those rights on and you have no way to sell them, then it might be better letting the publisher have them.

They're a very new company, so there's no track record I can check.

Old Hack said:
The contract clause reads to me as though it gives the publisher the right to sell rights on to other publishers and so on. But I am not good at contract law, so do not rely on me here.

That's the way it reads to me, but, like you, I'm not good at this either.

Old Hack said:
Is there something similar to the Society of Authors in Ireland? The UK SoA gives excellent contract advice to its members, completely free. You might want to look into that.

The Society of Authors looks a fabulous resource, but just at the moment I don't have the funds to join. :-(

Thanks for the input, Old Hack.

Old Hack · Apr 17, 2015

muse said:
They're a very new company, so there's no track record I can check.

If they don't have a track record, then I'd advise you to decline any offer you get from them.

You have no idea, yet, how effectively they'll publish you because you can't see how well they've done with anyone else. They might do well by you: but they might be dreadful publishers. If I were you I'd find someone else.

muse · Apr 18, 2015

Every publisher has to start somewhere, surely?

I do understand what you're saying, Old Hack, and it is a major concern that they are so new, but the lure of a contract is hard to resist.

Bubastes · Apr 18, 2015

muse said:
Every publisher has to start somewhere, surely?

I do understand what you're saying, Old Hack, and it is a major concern that they are so new, but the lure of a contract is hard to resist.

Sure, every publisher has to start somewhere, but you don't have to be its guinea pig.

NinjaFingers · Apr 18, 2015

Do not sign away any rights to a publisher that they do not have a solid history of using.

Do not sign away any rights to a publisher that they are not able to use.

Do not give them the right to sign away your rights.

I would NOT sign this. You can do better.

I signed ebook and print books to an e-first publisher. This ended with them refusing to either use or return the print rights.

Tell them you will only sign away the rights they will use and absolutely will not allow them to license to third parties. If they say no, walk away.

There are publishers out there who try to claim the movie rights so they can get a percentage of an option - that's probably what these people are after.

I know it's hard to walk away from a contract, but these people are rights grabbing. Don't let them.

muse · Apr 18, 2015

Bubastes said:
Sure, every publisher has to start somewhere, but you don't have to be its guinea pig.

Well, when you put it like that...

.

NinjaFingers said:
Do not sign away any rights to a publisher that they do not have a solid history of using.

Being new, they have no history, which is part of the problem.

NinjaFingers said:
Do not sign away any rights to a publisher that they are not able to use.

This is where I'm the newbie - I have no idea which rights they're not able to use. As it stands they want to do E books, with an option for POD, print and audio.

NinjaFingers said:
Do not give them the right to sign away your rights.

I would NOT sign this. You can do better.

Ah, so the licence to a third party is a bad thing?

NinjaFingers said:
I signed ebook and print books to an e-first publisher. This ended with them refusing to either use or return the print rights.

What a horrible situation. :Hug2:

NinjaFingers said:
Tell them you will only sign away the rights they will use and absolutely will not allow them to license to third parties. If they say no, walk away.

There are publishers out there who try to claim the movie rights so they can get a percentage of an option - that's probably what these people are after.

I know it's hard to walk away from a contract, but these people are rights grabbing. Don't let them.

Thanks for the advice, NinjaFingers. I have no problem with walking away. I just want to be sure it's for the right reasons.

WeaselFire · Apr 18, 2015

Contracts are negotiable. If you only want to sell them the first publication rights for Ugandan tortoise shell printings, then change the contract to say that. You can add reversion clauses so that a book is considered out of print and rights revert to the author after three years for example.

For example, I always remove any clauses committing me to submit my next works to the same publisher. I have multiple lines of work that I publish so I simply can't do that. Never had a publisher balk at that request. I have also negotiated to have rights restored for ebooks after the printed copy goes out of print. Though the publisher balked at that on the last book, ebooks are the current wave of the future. But, in return, I did negotiate a higher percentage on electronic publication as part of that deal.

In any case, have your agent or attorney read the contract and explain it.

Jeff

muse · Apr 19, 2015

Thanks for the input, Jeff. Some good points, especially about getting your ebook rights restored when the printed copy goes out of print.

In any case, have your agent or attorney read the contract and explain it.

That's my problem, I have neither.

Old Hack · Apr 19, 2015

muse said:
I have no problem with walking away. I just want to be sure it's for the right reasons.

A good reason for walking away is that the publisher is new and untested.

muse said:
That's my problem, I have neither.

Then you need to get one.

Would you buy a house without taking appropriate legal advice? No? Then why sell your book without appropriate legal advice?

Please be careful. You can find another publisher, or you can self publish. You can't repeat this book.

http://absolutewrite.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/

muse · Apr 20, 2015

Wise words, Old Hack.

I’ve taken everyone’s comments on board and emailed the publisher stating what rights I’m willing to give up and what I’m not. I’m guessing the offer of publication will be rescinded, and that’s okay.

It’s hard to believe that two weeks ago I had two publishers interested and now I have none.

Oh well, live and learn. :Shrug:

Thanks for all the help

NinjaFingers · Apr 20, 2015

You never know.

Sometimes they'll negotiate. On the other hand, I was well into negotiations with a comic publisher when they handed me an NDA I was not willing to sign as stood. I told them so and told them what I WAS willing to sign.

I never heard from them again.

So, yes, it's a risk, but it's less of a risk than being stuck in a bad contract.

muse · Apr 20, 2015

NinjaFingers said:
You never know.

Sometimes they'll negotiate. On the other hand, I was well into negotiations with a comic publisher when they handed me an NDA I was not willing to sign as stood. I told them so and told them what I WAS willing to sign.

I never heard from them again.

So, yes, it's a risk, but it's less of a risk than being stuck in a bad contract.

Agreed.

It's just hard to see beyond the fact that you actually have a contract. Good job I have the members of AW to keep me on the straight and narrow.

Treehouseman · Apr 23, 2015

A couple of things to also have in the contract (from my sad experience with newbies)

A "publish by" date. You don't want them stuffing you around for years before they do it.

Exactly in what format they intend to publish your story.

Rights reversion after 3 years (or a re-contracting). Some ask for 7, which is far too long.

muse · Apr 23, 2015

3 good points, Treehouseman. This particular contract seems to want to publish in all formats (eventually/maybe), and they wanted the rights for the full length of copyright - got that down to 10 years, which is still too long.

It seems the more I learn about rights and terms, the less I know. :Headbang:

Old Hack · Apr 24, 2015

Many good publishers take rights for the life of copyright, but then couple that with a good reversion clause which is triggered by falling sales. Don't assume that a life-of-copyright contract is a bad thing.

As for a contract which stipulates what format your book will be published in: that's standard. A publisher which does not specify this is a publisher I would look seriously askance at.

muse · Apr 26, 2015

Old Hack said:
Many good publishers take rights for the life of copyright, but then couple that with a good reversion clause which is triggered by falling sales. Don't assume that a life-of-copyright contract is a bad thing.

As for a contract which stipulates what format your book will be published in: that's standard. A publisher which does not specify this is a publisher I would look seriously askance at.

See. The more I learn the less I know.

Well, as expected, the publisher has now withdrawn their offer. I'm not disappointed, I know it's the right decision for me.

I guess it's time to start the submission process all over again.

I really appreciated all the help and advice given to me here.

Thanks, guys.

gingerwoman · Apr 26, 2015

The lure of a contact from a publisher with no track record really isn't much of a lure. Authors advise other authors to stay away from publishers who have been in business less than two years.

muse · Apr 27, 2015

gingerwoman said:
The lure of a contact from a publisher with no track record really isn't much of a lure. Authors advise other authors to stay away from publishers who have been in business less than two years.

Then how do publishers get started?

I'm not disagreeing with you, gingerwoman, in fact, I agree with you, but if all authors give new publishers a wide berth, then how do any of them ever get off the ground?

Bubastes · Apr 27, 2015

muse said:
Then how do publishers get started?

I'm not disagreeing with you, gingerwoman, in fact, I agree with you, but if all authors give new publishers a wide berth, then how do any of them ever get off the ground?

There's no shortage of authors willing to be guinea pigs. Check out the Bewares, Recommendations, and Background Check forum for plenty of examples. Many publishers fail, but not because they lack submissions.

muse · Apr 27, 2015

Bubastes said:
There's no shortage of authors willing to be guinea pigs. Check out the Bewares, Recommendations, and Background Check forum for plenty of examples. Many publishers fail, but not because they lack submissions.

Good job I have AW to keep me on the straight and narrow - never fancied being a guinea pig.

Bubastes · Apr 27, 2015

For starters, check out this great post by Cathy C on how publishers can fail and why AW asks the tough questions:

http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241409

gingerwoman · Apr 28, 2015

muse said:
Then how do publishers get started?

I'm not disagreeing with you, gingerwoman, in fact, I agree with you, but if all authors give new publishers a wide berth, then how do any of them ever get off the ground?

In addition to what Bubastes said, there are exceptions to this rule, where a new publishing company may be started up by someone with a lot of proven experience, and a sterling reputation at another publisher. Although I've actually seen a company like this completely fall apart in record time in one instance unfortunately.

gingerwoman · Apr 28, 2015

muse said:
Then how do publishers get started?

I'm not disagreeing with you, gingerwoman, in fact, I agree with you, but if all authors give new publishers a wide berth, then how do any of them ever get off the ground?

As Bubastes said it's not all authors giving a wide berth, just authors in the know.

Contract question.

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