Modern Story Format

nocomposer · Jul 15, 2014

I've read a lot of query letter advice, writing advice, etc, and one very important takeaway is [starting one's story off with a bang]. Hook them early. Get those pages turning.

This advice, coupled with a growing number of aspiring authors (and artists in general) who "want to make it", I think, is changing the way we tell stories which, in turn, is changing the way we think stories should be told.

Why should a story start with a hook? "Well, don't you want people to read it?!" Maybe so, but stories didn't always start with a hook, did they? At least not as big a hook. Some ambitious yet clumsy stories start with a hook so big that it's obviously meant to be a hook, which seems (to me) to be proof of the phenomenon.

I'm not saying I don't like stories that start with a hook--I start all my stories with a hook. But a lot of times--in TV shows, movies, and books--they're transparently formulaic. Desperate even.

Thoughts? Any good articles on the topic?

NRoach · Jul 15, 2014

There needs to be something to make the reader want to read, but it needn't be something as ridiculous as "It was the day my Grandmother exploded".

It's the difference between a tug on the collar from someone with their bedroom eyes on full beam and being yanked off stage by a crook.

asroc · Jul 15, 2014

I think most successful stories over time have started with something interesting, which is what I consider a hook. It doesn't have to be a murder or an explosion.

nocomposer · Jul 15, 2014

So neither of you believe there is any such...trend of late?

KateJJ · Jul 15, 2014

"Jacob Marley was dead to begin with"

"In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit"

"Call me Ishmael"

"You see, I had this space suit."

"Thunder and lightning, enter three witches"

All first lines (or in the last example, the stage directions for the opening act) from stories that are over 50 years old. The Heinlein example, from "Have Spacesuit Will Travel" is the most recent, the other books are much older. All hooks. All things I picked up as a kid and couldn't put down until I'd answered the question: what happens next.

Dennis E. Taylor · Jul 15, 2014

"It was a dark and stormy night..." :ROFL:

nocomposer · Jul 15, 2014

Good ones, Kate!

JustSarah · Jul 15, 2014

Well I don't think they should "start with a bang." Though I would agree that the plot turn should be something big. I like to call it "awakening the sleeping giant." Even if that's a subtler form of a giant, if your of a more non-genre persuasion.

When I was reading Jude The Obscure, I noted there seemed to be a lot of exposition. Which felt a bit clunky. On the other hand, Little Brother seemed to be well executed.

Though that could be an era style, I guess.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jul 15, 2014

Most books come with a hook in the back cover. So I don't think you need a huge bang in the first line, the first page, or even necessarily the first chapter. It can help, especially in certain genres, but you don't need it.

Jamesaritchie · Jul 15, 2014

nocomposer said:
I've read a lot of query letter advice, writing advice, etc, and one very important takeaway is [starting one's story off with a bang]. Hook them early. Get those pages turning.

This advice, coupled with a growing number of aspiring authors (and artists in general) who "want to make it", I think, is changing the way we tell stories which, in turn, is changing the way we think stories should be told.

Why should a story start with a hook? "Well, don't you want people to read it?!" Maybe so, but stories didn't always start with a hook, did they? At least not as big a hook. Some ambitious yet clumsy stories start with a hook so big that it's obviously meant to be a hook, which seems (to me) to be proof of the phenomenon.

I'm not saying I don't like stories that start with a hook--I start all my stories with a hook. But a lot of times--in TV shows, movies, and books--they're transparently formulaic. Desperate even.

Thoughts? Any good articles on the topic?

Define "hook". I think the entire "hook" advice is not only overrated, but doesn't happen nearly as often in books and movies as it does in advice forums.

But I've read as many classic novels as anyone, and the only real change I see with most of them is the language used, not with hook/no hook.

The only reason so many stories now start with a "hook" is because so many new writers believe everything they read in advice forums. The published novel I read by most of the good writers seldom start with anything like what's called a "hook" on most advice forums.

And the first sentence has to do is make the reader want to read the second. This has been true since man started writing. Langauge changes, but I really see very little difference in openings between modern novels, and nineteenth century novels, other than how language is used.

Different genres call for different things, of course, but when writers have a poor opening, it isn't because there's no hook, it;s because there's nothing there to hold reader interest, or if there is, it's poorly written.

RedWombat · Jul 15, 2014

But...but...WHAT ABOUT THE EXPLODING GRANDMOTHER!?

heza · Jul 15, 2014

I think probably "tension" is a better term than "hook."

Little Ming · Jul 15, 2014

Hook just means something interesting to keep the reader reading. It can be a beautiful description of a forest at dawn. Or it can be exploding grandmas. Whatever works for your story and makes the reader want more.

Ken · Jul 15, 2014

the only hooks that really annoy me are ones that are so obviously orchestrated

e.g. starting chpt one with what happens (or should happen) in chpt 5 to get to the thrilling scene right at once and get the audience's attention (chpt 2 then becomes chpt 1)

probably a term for such stuff ?

a real turn off

Little Ming · Jul 15, 2014

In Medias Res?

Ken · Jul 15, 2014

Ken said:
probably a term for such stuff ?

Little Ming said:
In Medias Res?

neat

thnx for the info

Roxxsmom · Jul 15, 2014

Looking at the opening lines of the last few novels I've read (and all are pretty recent, published within the past few years), I can't say any of the books open with the kind of hook you're describing. They seem to be either general background information that frames the story's beginning (when I was a girl, I..." kind of stuff), or a line describing some kind of action performed by a pov character (so and so closed his book and...), or even a description of a setting (the city of such and such was the...).

No exploding grandmothers or witty little lines that make me laugh, even.

I think one line hooks are a bit overstated for novels (queries and elevator pitches are another matter, of course). Those first line (or first three line contests) are fun, but I'm an amazingly picky reader, and I usually give a book at least a paragraph or two before I put it down.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jul 15, 2014

Little Ming said:
In Medias Res?

I don't mind in medias res in general; it's the version followed by a flashback that frustrates me. Starting in medias res in the classical sense doesn't involve the direct flashback scenes, it just involves skipping some exposition, which often works well and is not a cheap cop-out to having an interesting opening. Whenever someone pulls the preview version, I wanna slap 'em.

JustSarah · Jul 15, 2014

But what if your work doesn't use exposition? I mean I know what it is, but I've only ever read about it.

I understand the reason for some hooks though. And if done well, can actually have their own reader interpretation.

RedWombat · Jul 15, 2014

It was the day my grandmother exploded. Also the day of her eighteenth wedding.

Mom always said she'd get into trouble, carrying on with men like she did, but Gran liked men and men liked Gran. Problem was that she was a staunch Catholic and did not hold with foolin' around outside of marriage, so she dragged each one to the altar, sometimes a couple of times each. (She wasn't so good about divorcing them, but our parish priest had a soft spot for Gran and generally fudged the paperwork.)

The husbands were generally pretty good-natured about it--Gran being well-endowed in the charm department--but the last fellow was a small-time hit-man from Pittsburgh and it turned out his business associates weren't so good natured. I wouldn't think you could wire a bomb to a wedding cake, but mysterious are the ways of The Lord. Or the mob, anyhow.

The explosion was so loud it shorted out Uncle Willy's hearing aid and he kept saying "What? What? Is it the militias?" while bits of Gran, hit-man, wedding cake, and a discount wedding singer rained through the VFW dance hall. I turned to run, and that's when I saw the most beautiful woman I'd ever seen in my life.

We took shelter under a table while the booby-trapped wedding presents exploded all over the VFW and this would be an awfully short story except that Uncle Willy was under the same table and that cut things short in the romance department...

(Sorry. Had a moment there...)

dondomat · Jul 15, 2014

Jamesaritchie said:
Define "hook". I think the entire "hook" advice is not only overrated, but doesn't happen nearly as often in books and movies as it does in advice forums.

But I've read as many classic novels as anyone, and the only real change I see with most of them is the language used, not with hook/no hook.

The only reason so many stories now start with a "hook" is because so many new writers believe everything they read in advice forums. The published novel I read by most of the good writers seldom start with anything like what's called a "hook" on most advice forums.

Not only the writers, a new crop of readers and editors and even agents also feel that by memorizing and parroting back the buzzwords of the day, including "opening hook", they have mastered their field. The less impressive the publisher and agency--the more they cling to the notion of a check-list that starts with "opening hook", progresses into various "show don't tells" and "no headhoppings", has a strong "I am not your lawyer--I am your real mother" undercurrent because "three dimensional characters" is taken to mean "soap opera", and ends with "cliffhanger", because "everything should be a serial".

RedWombat said:
But...but...WHAT ABOUT THE EXPLODING GRANDMOTHER!?

The exploding grandmother served her purpose: she established Mr. Iain Banks as the day's premier dark postmodernist, respected by the ivory tower denizens, and when he undertook to satisfy the inner kid and singlehandedly revive epic space sci-fi, he succeeded, and continued to publish a hight lit book one year and an epic space battle book the next year, and it's thanks to him today we have not only the space marine/space medieval empire 1950's/60's type of cliche space sci-fi, but also The New Wave of British Space Opera made up of amazing books by the likes of Alastair Reynolds and Ken Macleod and Neal Asher, because the publishing establishment believed this new approach to space sci-fi could work, because a super popular dark postmodernist did it first.

And this was the tale of the exploding grandmother. Moral: once you're accepted as the cream of your generation, you can do anything, including influencing whole genres into the direction you deem desirable.

Helix · Jul 15, 2014

RedWombat said:
It was the day my grandmother exploded. Also the day of her eighteenth wedding.

Mom always said she'd get into trouble, carrying on with men like she did, but Gran liked men and men liked Gran. Problem was that she was a staunch Catholic and did not hold with foolin' around outside of marriage, so she dragged each one to the altar, sometimes a couple of times each. (She wasn't so good about divorcing them, but our parish priest had a soft spot for Gran and generally fudged the paperwork.)

The husbands were generally pretty good-natured about it--Gran being well-endowed in the charm department--but the last fellow was a small-time hit-man from Pittsburgh and it turned out his business associates weren't so good natured. I wouldn't think you could wire a bomb to a wedding cake, but mysterious are the ways of The Lord. Or the mob, anyhow.

The explosion was so loud it shorted out Uncle Willy's hearing aid and he kept saying "What? What? Is it the militias?" while bits of Gran, hit-man, wedding cake, and a discount wedding singer rained through the VFW dance hall. I turned to run, and that's when I saw the most beautiful woman I'd ever seen in my life.

We took shelter under a table while the booby-trapped wedding presents exploded all over the VFW and this would be an awfully short story except that Uncle Willy was under the same table and that cut things short in the romance department...

(Sorry. Had a moment there...)

Now that's a hook! I have to read the rest.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jul 15, 2014

Helix said:
Now that's a hook! I have to read the rest.

And here I thought it was flash fiction...

Liosse de Velishaf · Jul 15, 2014

dondomat said:
Not only the writers, a new crop of readers and editors and even agents also feel that by memorizing and parroting back the buzzwords of the day, including "opening hook", they have mastered their field. The less impressive the publisher and agency--the more they cling to the notion of a check-list that starts with "opening hook", progresses into various "show don't tells" and "no headhoppings", has a strong "I am not your lawyer--I am your real mother" undercurrent because "three dimensional characters" is taken to mean "soap opera", and ends with "cliffhanger", because "everything should be a serial".

The exploding grandmother served her purpose: she established Mr. Iain Banks as the day's premier dark postmodernist, respected by the ivory tower denizens, and when he undertook to satisfy the inner kid and singlehandedly revive epic space sci-fi, he succeeded, and continued to publish a hight lit book one year and an epic space battle book the next year, and it's thanks to him today we have not only the space marine/space medieval empire 1950's/60's type of cliche space sci-fi, but also The New Wave of British Space Opera made up of amazing books by the likes of Alastair Reynolds and Ken Macleod and Neal Asher, because the publishing establishment believed this new approach to space sci-fi could work, because a super popular dark postmodernist did it first.

And this was the tale of the exploding grandmother. Moral: once you're accepted as the cream of your generation, you can do anything, including influencing whole genres into the direction you deem desirable.

I guess I better write the next Wasp Factory before I start pumping out retro space opera and mage punk...

Shadow_Ferret · Jul 15, 2014

You have to have something in that first page to get the reader to continue reading. Not necessarily a "hook" per se, but something. A unique character, an interesting setting, a writing style that draws them in... something.

Why? Because there is so much competition for the consumer's attention and dollar and much of it is of a passive nature where there is little effort required by the consumer to enjoy it. Reading is work. It requires your imagination to be in gear to "see" everything in the story. Television, movies, you can just veg out and let the story unfold before you. And games are something between the two, you need to be actively engaged to understand and solve the puzzles, but the consumer only minimally uses his imagination because games, too, are a visual medium and the characters are shown to you, the setting is shown to you.

Modern Story Format

nocomposer

likes to write stories

NRoach

asroc

Alex

nocomposer

likes to write stories

KateJJ

coffee and pistols at dawn

Dennis E. Taylor

Get it off! It burns!

nocomposer

likes to write stories

JustSarah

Liosse de Velishaf

Jamesaritchie

RedWombat

Runs With Scissors

heza

Little Ming

Ken

Little Ming

Ken

Roxxsmom

Beastly Fido

Liosse de Velishaf

JustSarah

RedWombat

Runs With Scissors

dondomat

Helix

socially distancing

Liosse de Velishaf

Liosse de Velishaf

Shadow_Ferret

Court Jester