Head Hopping?

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ellisnation

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My novel consists of two POV's. There is zero head hopping throughout the entire story. I have been soooooo cautious! However, I am at the end. It's women's fiction and the scene is semi-romantic, not sexual though. The two MC's are talking/fighting about getting back together... can I head hop here? I've tried seperating this one scene into 2 seperate pov's but it takes the passion out of it.

Are there exceptions to head hopping and would this be one of them? Thanks!
 

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Off the top, I would say, if you've had no head hopping in the rest of the book, starting now would be confusing.
The two MC's are talking/fighting about getting back together

I'm thinking I'd try to write it from the POV of the one who has the most to lose. (Just an idea.)

By the way -
Welcome to the 'Cooler!
 

CaroGirl

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That's a tough one, I think. If you've established the characters well up to this point, and spent lots of time inside each of their heads, it might work fine to hop from one viewpoint to another. Why don't you write it the way you think it works best, get some betas to read the whole thing, and see if the head hopping is an issue? If so, you can always rewrite the scene. You might even find, yourself, it doesn't work after you've written it.
 

Danthia

I'd be wary of head hopping at the end. You'll likely confuse the reader. I'd do as suggested above and pick one and show the scene from their POV. That keeps you in one head, and it also allows you to keep the tension up, because the reader won't know what both sides are thinking and feeling. Think of how much you'd lose if there was no mystery at the end.
 

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Besides the dialogue, you can show your readers the other character's feelings by the way in which they react to what's said.
 

nevada

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No head hopping. Ever. Especially since you haven't done it throughout the whole book. Like Samantha says, show the other character's feelings by dialogue and reaction. I'm sorry but you'll have to make a choice. Pick one character, who has the most to lose or to gain, and stick with him/her. It may look like you lose the drama but part of the drama comes from not knowing what the other character is thinking and having to depends on only his words and actions. or hers. Good luck. It can be done. Don't cheat now. :)
 

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:editor's hat on:

The two MC's are talking/fighting about getting back together... can I head hop here?

No. Seriously, no.

If I'm any good at my job I will ask you for a rewrite. You've not done the mental tennis match through the rest of the book, so it would be a nasty jarring thing for the reader if you let them down here in the Big Finish. It smacks of being in a hurry and sloppy writing.

Your suspense can come from a single character wondering if the other character will deliver them to a Happily Ever After.

I've tried seperating this one scene into 2 seperate pov's but it takes the passion out of it.

It's doable, fixable, rewritable. You just have to walk away for a bit, come back with fresh eyes, and tackle it. I once had a similar scene that I thought wouldn't work in a single VP, but I figured it out, and it worked great.

During your time out, read similar endings--by writers who do NOT head-hop--to see how they solved it.

As one NYT bestseller, whose works totally rawk, said, "They're only words."

You'll find a good discussion we just had on this topic on this forum thread.
 

MMcDonald64

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No head hopping. Ever. :)

I disagree. I know that it is taught as a big no-no, but there are quite a few published authors who do it. LaVryle Spencer does it quite well in Morning Glory. She might in other books too, but for sure in that one. I also just read a book by Taylor Anderson called "Into the Storm", and he also head hops. It's not quite as well done as LaVryle Spencer, but it's easy to figure out whose pov it is in just a few words.

I do agree that suddenly doing it at the end of the book wouldn't be a good idea though. That would be confusing.
 

maestrowork

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Pick one POV and reveal the other character through their interactions, dialogue, actions, etc. You CAN reveal so much passion without ever going inside a character's head.
 

ellisnation

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Ok ok ok. I KNOW you are all right about not head hopping now. It's essential that I leave this particular chapter with tons of mystery, so I will rewrite it.

Thanks for the input! You guys rock! I couldn't have gotten through this without AW's help :)
 

nevada

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I disagree. I know that it is taught as a big no-no, but there are quite a few published authors who do it. LaVryle Spencer does it quite well in Morning Glory. She might in other books too, but for sure in that one. I also just read a book by Taylor Anderson called "Into the Storm", and he also head hops. It's not quite as well done as LaVryle Spencer, but it's easy to figure out whose pov it is in just a few words.

I do agree that suddenly doing it at the end of the book wouldn't be a good idea though. That would be confusing.

SO do Nora Roberts and Elizabeth Lowell. Morning Glory was written over 20 yrs ago when head hopping was the style. Nora Roberts used to be really bad for it but she's learned to reign it in a lot. What does it tell you when someone as successful as Nora Roberts, who could publish her grocery list and have it land on the NYT Best seller list is aware of the evils of headhopping (hyperbole to make a funny :) ) and actively works on eliminating it.


teh short and the long is just because authors like nora roberts get away with it doesn't mean that every author can. Most editors (Look at gillhoughy's reaction) will have an author fix the headhopping.
 

CaroGirl

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I think the rule here is the same as the one that applies in all other situations. Do what works. We all preach against head hopping because it's out of fashion and perceived as confusing, which it often is. Introducing one scene with head hopping at the end of a book might well be seen as confusing and an example of lazy writing, particularly by editors, writers and reviewers, moreso than average readers.

I've read recent examples of very popular novels written in that style. For example, The Bee Season and 26A by Diana Evans, which won the Orange Prize for fiction in 2005.

In almost every case, head hopping creates a terrible, confusing mess for readers. Occasionally, it works, even in modern fiction.
 

nevada

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I'm sorry caro , i have to disagree. I just read an excerpt of Bee Season and it's written in Third Omniscient. That's not head hopping. That's a totally different POV from 3rd limited. It's a cool book. I'm going to have to read it. Thanks for mentioning it. I find the best books this way. I knew of the movie, didnt think to look at the book. thanks. :)
 

CaroGirl

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I'm sorry caro , i have to disagree. I just read an excerpt of Bee Season and it's written in Third Omniscient. That's not head hopping. That's a totally different POV from 3rd limited. It's a cool book. I'm going to have to read it. Thanks for mentioning it. I find the best books this way. I knew of the movie, didnt think to look at the book. thanks. :)
I read it two years ago and, with my then-limited knowledge of, well, anything writing related, it seemed like head hopping to me. I felt sure there were thoughts and feelings in there. (?)

Try taking a look at 26A. I'm pretty sure that's head hopping. But maybe that's omni too and the problem is me knowing which is which.
 

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Caro Shields' The Republic of Love has two characters who appear in alternate chapters, and then meet half way through the book. I think she solves it by writing in omniscient third throughout. Third limited with head hopping would be annoying to me.
 

nevada

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just checked 26A, definitely 3rd omniscient. You can have people's feelings and thoughts in 3rd omniscient. the only time you dont ever have people's thoughts and feelings in 3rd person POV is when you write 3rd objective. in 3rd objective, the unseen narrator/author only relays the characters actions and not their thoughts so as reader we can only ever interpret what a character might be thinking by what he's doing. as maestro pointed out in another thread, movie scripts are 3rd objective.

Here's how maestro explained the differences in 3rd POVs, and i think he explains it perfectly.

I think that's one thing a lot of people get confused with 3rd limited with head-hopping.

3rd limited -- filtered through the characters. Narrative voice may assume that of the POV character.

3rd omniscient -- filtered through the omniscient narrator, who knows everything and decides who and what to focus on. The narrator has its own distinct voice and may intrude.

3rd objective -- is similar to omniscient except it doesn't go inside any character's mind or filter anything through their perspectives. It's also called the "camera" point of view; like in movies, there is no point of view and you don't get to read the characters' minds. This is the most distant of all points of view.

check out the link that gillhoughly posted above. it talks about headhopping in more detail including an example that includes the pov of the dog. (my example of extreme headhopping. lol )

Somewhere, and i can't find it now, maestro says that the difference between 3rd omniscient and head hopping is the unseen narrator. there is a narrator in 3rd omniscient, but not in head hopping. I totally agree with maestro. (i'm not sucking up, lol i just happen to agree with him and he said it better than I. :D ) in head hopping the writer just throws you willy nilly into whoever's head at any given time, sometimes several heads during the course of one sentence without any filter at all.
 
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blacbird

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Besides the dialogue, you can show your readers the other character's feelings by the way in which they react to what's said.

I agree. And the implication, of course, is the question: Do you really need to be inside your characters' thoughts as much as you are? Many writers have a common misconception that they need to relate characters' thoughts all the time, for readers' benefit. Here can definitely be a place where less is more. Especially if, as you say, your main characters are "talking/fighting". Let them talk and fight more, and think less.

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I disagree. I know that it is taught as a big no-no, but there are quite a few published authors who do it. LaVryle Spencer does it quite well in Morning Glory. She might in other books too, but for sure in that one. I also just read a book by Taylor Anderson called "Into the Storm", and he also head hops. It's not quite as well done as LaVryle Spencer, but it's easy to figure out whose pov it is in just a few words.

I do agree that suddenly doing it at the end of the book wouldn't be a good idea though. That would be confusing.

Just because published authors do it, doesn't make it right.

Barbara Taylor Bradford and Martina Cole head hop like nobody's business but I still wouldn't just because they get away with it. (Well, I don't think they do but they're published and I'm not, yet, so what do I know)?

As much as I hate to agree with nevada again :)ROFL:) - no head hopping.

Ever.
 

FennelGiraffe

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Here's how maestro explained the diff between head hopping and omniscient, and i think he explains it perfectly.
I think that's one thing a lot of people get confused with 3rd limited with head-hopping.

3rd limited -- filtered through the characters. Narrative voice may assume that of the POV character.

3rd omniscient -- filtered through the omniscient narrator, who knows everything and decides who and what to focus on. The narrator has its own distinct voice and may intrude.
...

Somewhere, and i can't find it now, maestro says that the difference between 3rd omniscient and head hopping is the unseen narrator. there is a narrator in 3rd omniscient, but not in head hopping. I totally agree with maestro. (i'm not sucking up, lol i just happen to agree with him and he said it better than I. :D ) in head hopping the writer just throws you willy nilly into whoever's head at any given time, sometimes several heads during the course of one sentence without any filter at all.

While I understand the difference in theory, I'm still struggling with recognizing it in practice. Any suggestions?
 

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I notice 3rd omni when the narrator interjects an opinion that couldn't possibly be shared by any of the characters. For example, in Revolutionary Road, Frank Wheeler is described as having "the kind of unemphatic good looks that a discerning photographer might use to portray the discerning consumer of well-made but inexpensive merchandise (Why Pay More?)." That bit of snarky editorial is clearly from the omniscient narrator, not from Frank Wheeler describing himself. Does that help?
 

maestrowork

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I've mentioned Lord of the Flies as a perfect example of 3rd omniscient, not 3rd limited. If you read carefully, you'd notice that there's indeed an "invisible" narrator separate from all the characters. The narrator may choose to focus on Ralph, for example -- the narrator knows everything about him and what he's thinking or feeling and can also report on things Ralph doesn't know, but the narrator is not Ralph (or any other characters, for that matter), nor does it assume Ralph's personality or perspective. This narrative voice is established every early on and does not waver throughout the entire book.

In 3rd limited, such as Old Man and the Sea, the narrator is like a shape-shifter who assumes the identity of the character, but continue to refer the character in third person. The narrator is not, however, all-knowing. The narrator can only report on things the character knows and feels and thinks. Sometimes the narrator assumes the character's personality and voice -- for example, the simple prose of a fisherman. In essence, 3rd limited is kind of like first person -- you're limited to one character's perspective at a time. You can, however, switch between multiple POVs but only one at a time.

When you're switching at will (within a scene, etc.) then you're head-hopping. So how is 3rd limited with head-hopping different from omniscient? The difference lies in the discipline the authors has in maintaining a single, unified narrator. In that case, it's omniscient -- an all-knowing single narrator. We may not be able to tell the difference by reading an excerpt or two, but within the context of the entire novel, you'd know. The omniscient narrator doesn't waver, doesn't change voices or personalities based on the characters. The narrator is constant.
 
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Samantha's_Song

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Ya know, I would love to write a novel using 3rd omni and giving my own comments on it. It would have to be a humorous novel though, and not one for the faint-hearted :D

I notice 3rd omni when the narrator interjects an opinion that couldn't possibly be shared by any of the characters. For example, in Revolutionary Road, Frank Wheeler is described as having "the kind of unemphatic good looks that a discerning photographer might use to portray the discerning consumer of well-made but inexpensive merchandise (Why Pay More?)." That bit of snarky editorial is clearly from the omniscient narrator, not from Frank Wheeler describing himself. Does that help?
 

CaroGirl

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I notice 3rd omni when the narrator interjects an opinion that couldn't possibly be shared by any of the characters. For example, in Revolutionary Road, Frank Wheeler is described as having "the kind of unemphatic good looks that a discerning photographer might use to portray the discerning consumer of well-made but inexpensive merchandise (Why Pay More?)." That bit of snarky editorial is clearly from the omniscient narrator, not from Frank Wheeler describing himself. Does that help?
Okay. So, that's interesting. I don't recall the omniscient narrator in either of the examples I cited (Bee Season or 26A), but that might be because I wasn't looking for it. Methinks I need a trip back into those novels, assuming I can find them in the jumbled pile that lives on my bedroom floor.

I love Lord of the Flies and I understand what you mean in that novel. It's a very clear example and I thank you, Ray, for that one.
 
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