A question of race

This thread might get me in trouble, but I hope not.

I built a world for one novel & have brought it into my NaNoWriMo novel w/ a different MC & different parts of this world. There are pretty standard(ish) fantasy type creatures. Not like elves, dwarves, orcs, etc, but fairies & other winged creatures, & races w/ plant-like features. Some trolls & a unicorn (person), but mostly of my own creation, or a variation on something that you might see in the D&D Monster Manuals. Lots & lots of magic.

Anyway, I started off with one main race who interacted with original main characters. They're a race known as Fae (although different from what you'd think of as fey), & tend to be the best magic users. That story goes thru lots of other races, but Fae are the most prominent. They don't have a religion, per se, but their beliefs are based on this basic magical force. There's also a part of the force that is evil, so most shun it. Some embrace it.

As part of the story for the first book, I entered an aspect into where Fae, who normally have super-pale skin, will have their soul tainted w/ the use of the evil magic. Along with this, they will be marked with darker & darker skin until they are consumed by the evil magic. This came about because many Fae assumed my MC were evil based on their darker skin, until they learned better. However, it wasn't a major part of that story.

In the new story, I want to introduce a character who used the evil magic once, didn't even know what he was doing, but has had his soul tainted by it. His skin is a dark gray color. My MC would immediately see this & believe him to be completely evil until he proved himself to her (He would eventually do so, but of course, it wouldn't be there until later in the novel). Anyone else she saw w/ similar skin tone would also be assumed to be evil as well.

Now, let me just say that my original MCs have a small cameo in the beginning & she adores them, & as I said b4, they have dark skin too.

Now, if i published this novel (or tried), would it be assumed that I was trying to make a racist statement because of the whole Fae skin color thing? I really hope not, as I have no intention of making any such statement. It was just an interesting aspect of the magic of this world that I added to the first story to add some conflict for the characters. I love the idea of this new character coming & throwing everything my new MC believes into chaos by not being the person she expects him to be, and I hope that I don't have to change the character concept because it would be seen as bad.

Do you think it would?

Mike Coombes said:

It could certainly be read that way.

Many black people have a problem with the commotations attached to black - blackguard, blackmail, black-hearted, black magic - as opposed to white,. which represents purity etc.

Helping to reinforce that risks alienating a large part of your audience - worse still you risk tainting yourself with the whiff of racism.

At the end of the day, white who do bad things turning black, which is your basic premise, could be considered very distasteful. Why not have them get some kind of facial birthmark, or turn purple?

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Thanks for your honest answer, Mike. Would purple really be better than gray, tho, or would any color be seen as bad?

To be fair, as you mention "black magic" that would basically be what they'd be using, tho it's called by another name. But that's where the premise came from. It was dark magic they were using, it was dark that they were becoming. I used a grey scale because someone w/ white (I mean bleach white) or light grey skin could go into our world & be distinct enough to catch someone's eye, but not so distinct (as a purple tone would be) that they couldn't pass as human for a short while. (Turning purple (as an example) would also take away from that small conflict for my MCs as well)

Does it not make it better that this character that she believes is evil, actually ends up proving himself as good, thus turning her belief on its ear? Likewise there are many lighter-skinned characters w/ questionable value systems who have never used the evil magic, but will lie, cheat, steal, & kill, but show no visible signs of this. Would that make it more acceptable as well?

I'm just trying to make sure I give a clear picture of what I'm talking about so I can get the best idea of how this would be accepted (or not) before I get so far into that conflict (the character's just been introduced for the first time in today's writing) that it would be almost impossible to rewrite it. Also, I really do love the character, & would like to keep him if at all possible, but if it really would be a huge issue, I'd like to know.

The black=norm, white=evil would work perfectly fine for this story... not as well for the other. Though, right now I'm picturing my main supporting characters in the first story as pure black, & they'd still be very pretty & sexy in an exotic way like they were when they were pure white (which is part of how the first catches the eye of my MC), there's an action later that end up resulting in a slight glow over some of the characters, that is meant to be subtle to the eye of someone looking at them, but still there. I don't think the subtlety would work as well if it's a glow over black, though. I could write the subtlety out, but then everyone's automatic reaction upon seeing them would be, "OMG, you did that?!" I could write the glow out, but it's really helpful & cool imagery in the scene where it first appears, & then gets the attention of at least two other people who otherwise I would have to find another reason for them to figure out what was done (w/in a small period of time). One would be easy. The other not so much.

My other worry in going from black to white is that it might be seen as more of a racial statement in the other direction. "Look how I am turning society around by making it be 'whites' who are evil, & 'blacks' who are good." (And of course, then I'll be slammed for all the dark-skinned people in that scenario who lie, cheat, steal, kill).

As for why darkness is often used for as a symbol like this, it's 'cuz darkness can be scary. Not dark skin, mind you, but dark outside, dark rooms, the absence of light. Monsters supposedly live in the dark as 'things that go bump in the night.' Nighttime was a far scarier world when we didn't have electrical lights everywhere. Even w/ them, you're more likely to get attacked by someone in the dark, & therefore it is seen as a more dangerous time. The ancient chinese symbol of the yinyang has the black half be negative (& also femaleness), & the white half be positive (& also male). I don't think anybody would be accused of racism (sexism, maybe) by using the symbol in a book (at least I hope not, since I did, & gave the black half to my male MC & the white half to the female MC). White is the color of light. Black is the absence of light. All these things, having absolutely nothing w/ race at all, contribute to the imagery of light being good & dark being bad. I don't think I have a problem w/ saying that somebody has darkness in their soul. And I do. That's a very important character statement for one of my important characters in the first book (& probably will be important in this one). And it would sound ridiculous to say that there's a "lightness" in their soul. The problem would be in the changing of the skin. But as w/ the glow I mentioned from the other story, this would be the easiest feature that someone could see & say right away, "I know you used dark magic," which is an important point for my character in this new story.

That said, since I'm doing NaNo, I'm going to continue writing the story, but keep in mind your suggestion, Loquax. I can't rework the entire story & character on such short notice, but when I'm finished I could go back & anything I decided was bad, I can change. This means I could change light to dark, gray to blue... whatever I feel like, & can then take my time to go thru the other story as well & figure out what I can do there.

Please continue giving me comments & suggestions, 'cuz I really do want to know how this will be received & how I can keep it similar in concept but less controversial. Thanks, everyone for your comments so far.

Leanan-Sidhe said:

I agree that symbollically white has always been seen to represent purity and black evil. There's not much anyone can do to change that. I think the problem here is that you have it in relation to skin color. Why not have your character's eyes change to black or something? Just something other than skin so that you steer clear of the racist issue.

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Eyes wouldn't be prominent enough to notice at a single glance. However, since starting this thread, I have considered hair color instead of skin color (even though this will be suggestive of "blond is better," I don't think it would be as big an issue). Hair is one of the first things I personally notice about someone's look, so I think that would be evident enuf for my MC to notice that this boy has used evil magic upon their first meeting.

I'm still thinking & taking suggestions. Thanks everyone.

fallenangelwriter said:

I think you can probably get away with it. a few people might consider it rascist, but i wouldn't.


if you're worried, you could either make the blackness one of several symptoms of dark magic. or, emphasize that thier skin really becomes BLACK. after all, real "black" people are generally brownish, not actually pitch black.

the reverse color idea makes a lot of sense too. cave dwelling things lose pigment and turn white, and evil, underground, and darkness are closely associated. plus, turning white is like bleach, and that, to me, fell scary and dangeorus. they're symbolically using up their lif force, becoming less alive.

also, you could pick some other color entirely. remember that in japan, white is the color of death. but there could be other colors of evil. maybe it's a reddish tinge, as for blood. maybe blue is the color of this world's "dark Lord," or the cold embrace of the sea is considered mroe terrifying than darkness.

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Thanks. The scale is from bleach white to pitch black w/ gray tones in between, which is why initially when I first realized that it might be seen as a racist thing, I hope that that difference would be enuf (as well as any prejudice that the MC has against those who appear to her to be evil being proven unfounded) to make it okay. The character who would be part of the main cast (if he'd ever cooperate) is described as a charcoal gray.

The main symptom of the use of the evil magic is the tainting of the soul. For this race (& this race only) that shows up on the skin (at least as I have it now). Since my original MC are Japanese, going from black to white might work in that respect. Though, it still will be harder to explain how a darkness in the soul would result in a lightness of the skin/hair/whatever. As for the religion of this world, it is based solely on magic, so there's just good vs. evil magic, with two powerful people who can wield them that are respected or feared from each side. But who they are is also a mystery for most people in the world. Even those that worship evil magic don't know who is the one who will rule them if she wins, until after she fights the good person.

Somebody mentioned that horns or fangs or hunchbacks were less stereotypical of showing someone as evil than changing a person's skin. Maybe it's just 8 years of Buffy/Angel talking here, but considering that horns & fangs, especially, belong to demons (& hunchbacks as the henchmen of mad scientists), I can't see that as true. But that's just me. Either way, I can't see using that kind of imagery for this particular plot point. But thanks anyway.

I knew I shouldn't have read the newest post b4 I went to bed 'cuz now if I don't respond it will make me think about it.

I dunno, but apart from the racism angle, having a world where 'good' people and 'bad' people can be seen apart at first glance doesn't seem like a setup for good drama.

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That's just the point, though. It seems like they could, but really the MC finds out they can't.

From a world building point of view, it also seems like a really cheap way out. It always annoyed me in the LOTR movies that you could instantly tell at a glance whether someone was 'good' or 'bad' - because the 'bad' people had facial deformities and were ugly.

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This is a world where there are many many different races. In one particular one, I have it set up so that they are marked when they use dark magic. In all the others, this is not so. Anyone who does not use dark magic, but still does something wrong (killing a large group of people, including innocents, for example), would not be marked in this way.

The depth to the characters come about not thru the marking, but by defying what one might expect. For example, based on my description, despite the many times I have said that it was only dark magic that causes the change, if I introduced you to a major character that had light gray skin, you would assume he was a good person all his life (I'm basing this on your post above). When it is mentioned that he his paying off a debt, suddenly you have reason to wonder what that is. If way down the line, it becomes clear that his debt is to the lives of the great number of people he needlessly killed, this might come as a complete shock to you because you had assumed that the only bad people had the dark gray --> black skin. Likewise, when you come across a character w/ dark grey skin, you'd assume that he is evil. The MC certainly does. So why is it that he ends up helping her when she is stabbed later or he cares when she cries about a broken device? Why is that the panic in his eyes causes her to care enough to hide him even though she believes him to be evil? Well, read on to find out ;-)

If you are doing this for the sake of a single line "I know you used dark magic", there are other ways than someone's appearance. For a start, using dark magic may give the user more knowledge or finer senses. That way, neither the MC nor the audience knows for much of the story whether the person is 'good' or 'bad' until they let slip some extra information. (eg: Reading a mind, hearing a sound outside normal hearing range, seeing too far, etc etc)

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The line is not even a line I use, just a representation of what the reaction would be upon seeing this character. The knowledge needs to be instantaneous. Dark gray character is guilty until proven innocent, while light gray character is innocent until proven guilty. There are other mysteries about the characters to be found out, I don't need the mystery to be first that dark gray guy did the bad act, & then secondly to say, "Just kidding. You thought that was his secret, but really he's okay like you initially thought."

You mentioned Buffy - Buffy became a lot more interesting when there was more depth to the characters - when you couldn't tell just by looking at someone (or by taking their pulse) whether they were 'good' or 'bad'. Sometimes the person themself didn't even know. (eg: Spike)

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Spike was a very interesting character (my fave), but he started out w/ us knowing he was evil. We knew he was a vamp from teh first time we saw him (& back then they bothered making them pale so that you could guess even b4 the game face or killing). Only after several seasons did we start seeing William as well as Spike. Even Angel, who was introduced as cryptically good, I suspected was a vamp from ep 1, so the mystery for him was really why he was helping Buffy.

As I mentioned from the first post, this world is in two novels. The first has major characters who are secretively manipulating the main characters, w/ only hints dropped about it for the audience. "Which, if any, of these (non-main) characters is evil?" would be the question of that novel. "Which, if any, of these (non-main) characters is good?" would, I guess, sum up what my MC needs to figure out for this story (well, along w/ the other mystery & the big bad she needs to battle)

azbikergirl said:

Having been on the receiving end of racial prejudice, I'm one of those readers sensitive to skin color as indicator of good/evil (even if it proves not to be true). But some other ideas, if you're still open to them:

make the evil people's skin slough off
give them a horrible rash
cover them with fur
harden their feet into hooves

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Thanks for the suggestions, azbikergirl. I was wondering what you thought of the light=bad,dark=good suggestions some were giving me (or one of the other color suggestions as well). Would you still be as sensitive about a race whose skin washed out as they were consumed by evil? Or is any mention of skin color in this way going to rub you the wrong way? I ask 'cuz it's one of the two ways I'm considering solving the problem, but I'd like to know if it actually would.

I really want this to be a simple (but prominent) cosmetic change, & am seriously considering the hair color or a reversal in colors (if I can make it work for both stories. Hair would be easier). I'd prefer not to transform them physiologically, but rather, cosmetically, & I especially want to avoid giving them attributes that can be considered demonic, or that I have or may use for completely different races (I just added a race that was similar to that one but w/ so much hair on their bodies the MC thought they were an animal on two legs at first, so your suggestion of that made me smile )

I still am taking all your guys' suggestions seriously, whether I think they might work or I know they won't for me. Thanks for helping.