Interview With Carla Winter
Interview by Jenna Glatzer

Carla is the co-editor of William Fox, Sol M. Wurtzel and the Early Fox Film Corporation.  She is the grand-niece of Sol M. Wurtzel, and, along with Sol's daughter, Lillian Wurtzel Semenov, she put together and found a publisher for the correspondence that took place between Sol and William Fox in the early days of the Fox Film Corporation.

Not yet realizing her genetic heritage for business and entertainment, Carla Winter created CW Entertainment in 1985 by pure instinct. Her company specializes in providing music and variety entertainment for parties, picnics and special events throughout the SF Bay Area. Carla is a multi-faceted party talent, too.

Who was Sol M. Wurtzel, and why has the world never heard of him?  

Sol M. Wurtzel ultimately was an executive producer for the Fox Film Corporation.  He began his career as a bookkeeper for William Fox, who was just establishing his business that grew into an empire.  Within a year, he became Fox's personal secretary and eventually was sent to Hollywood to build the studios. At that time, he handled every aspect of business operations for the studio and discovered a passion for film production.  His career spanned from circa 1915-1946.   He established an independent production company whose films were released through Fox until he retired in 1950.  In the course of his career, he produced about 1200 films and was responsible for discovering and developing many major talents including John Ford, Shirley Temple, and Will Rogers, just to name a few.  His lot produced the "B" rated movies, which made profits for the company but always lacked the glamour and prestige of the "A" movies, which frequently bombed.

I'm semi-baffled as to why he's been consistently overlooked and I am doing everything I can possibly think of to get my great Uncle Sol Wurtzel the acknowledgement and credit he justly deserves.  As to why he never got his full credit?  There are interesting power and ego struggles in Hollywood which are still operational today.  And despite all he contributed to the film industry, including the style and look of film itself as clearly depicted in the colorful correspondence and can easily be observed and compared, those in power never empowered him nor credited him.  And, even in my current experience, there still appear to be some forces blocking his credit, which I'll dive into a little later, as they seem a bit metaphysical in nature.  

Your book contains letters between Mr. Wurtzel and William Fox.  How did you get these letters?  

In the 60s, Sol's son (my cousin Paul) found the letters while cleaning the basement of his family's estate.  He gave them to his sister Lillian, who compiled them in the 80s and attempted to publish them. She was rejected throughout the United States and England, so she gave up and put the manuscript away.  Then in the 90s, I saw a "Biography of the History of the Fox Film Corporation" that didn't look anything like how I knew the business.  Most of my relatives were associated with the studio, including my grandfather, Sam, who was not only a unit head, but got his brother (Sol) his job in the first place.  So, while visiting LA, I saw Lillian and asked her, "I heard your father ran the studio-- what does that mean?"  We went to her apartment and she handed me the manuscript to review.  Although I was permitted by Lillian to pursue the project, it was not a carte blanche opportunity.  There was nothing easy about any aspect of this work.

This may be a silly question, but how did Mr. Wurtzel have the letters he sent to Mr. Fox?  Did he make copies of everything before sending them?  

Uncle Sol was an assiduous record keeper.  Thank God for that, or these letters never would have been discovered.  I notice some key letters are missing, and I don't know whether my cousin withheld them or not, and I can't ask her as she died in the middle of my publishing pursuit.  I think it was pretty smart of Sol to keep copies so he and Fox could talk from the same page regarding any of the business details; it was just much more difficult in those days to make copies.

This book is a riot-- it reads like a comedy film in itself.  We've got Mr. Fox as Ebenezer Scrooge; the demanding, never-satisfied, controlling, tight-pursed head of the company, and Mr. Wurtzel as Bob Cratchit; the underpaid, overworked, cow-towing servant who gets blamed for everything and gets credit for nothing, while developing nervous tics and never being allowed to come visit his family.  I know it's impossible for you to know for sure, but why do you suppose Mr. Wurtzel allowed himself to be treated this way?  

Boy, did you nail the psychological profile in a nutshell!  Several of my relatives have asked the same question. 

The immigrant Wurtzel family was extremely poor, with five boys to feed.  I wear a ring that Sol's mother used to pawn to be able to buy food for the family.  Adolf, the father, was strict and abusive; however, they sacrificed a great deal in order for Sol to be educated and make something of himself.  I believe Sol transferred his morality as a dutiful son to Fox and maintained his family values consistently by hiring the family and keeping them going as a payback for the sacrifice his parents made.  Although the character of Sol is Cratchit-like in the correspondence, Sol later on in his career acquired some Fox-like qualities.  My relatives tell me he could be quite charming but also incredibly nasty.  It's somewhat classically tragic how the abused becomes the abuser. 

Did you have to get permission from any of Fox's relatives or the film corporation to release this book?  

Yes, and that set me back about 2 to 2 1/2 years.  Talk about a stonewalling experience. OY!  It was like trying to climb Mt. Everest, thinking you are nearly there, turning a corner and discovering you still had another mountain to climb.  Then, finally getting there, another setback was the death of Lillian, so I then had to renegotiate with the family.  It was very difficult getting permissions and I could not progress without them.  It took my absolute commitment to the project-- it was going to get done and nothing was going to stop me.  There are some interesting details, but I ultimately used my cunning, determination and perseverance to obtain the legal clearances to publish. This question is really pulling a cork from a pressured bottle. I'm not sure you would want that stuff to spew forth.

How did you find a publisher? 

I first took a class on how to sell to the movies, as I thought the work looked like numerous films.  I was told I needed to get the work published first.  I tried cold calling various publishers and met with typical rejection. Lillian gave me the lead of Scott Eyman, a well known Hollywood historian who was doing a bio on John Ford.  He discovered Uncle Sol was executor of his estate and knocked on our door.  After Lillian's death, I gave him a call and he gave me a lead on a small publisher who said they would do the work, except they didn't really care whether I had Fox Family & Corporation clearance or not and were nasty and abusive to me.  They were not willing to take any responsibility, but were willing to put my neck on the line... so I declined to work with them.

At Lillian's funeral, I stood up and spoke my heart of the job she and I had been working on and my determination to get the history of Hollywood, particularly where it concerned our Wurtzel clan, correct.  A close family friend who's spent a lifetime in Feature Story Files at Fox said she'd help if she could.  She ultimately made a presentation to a committee devoted to projects celebrating 75 years of films.  A member of the committee, who was the research librarian at the time, went to a film/books convention and met the senior publisher of McFarland press and pitched my project... the shoe finally fit.

When you read this collection of letters for the first time, what made you want to share it with the public?

I was stunned when I first read the letters by the sense of historical truth, along with all the Hollywood theatrics.  Truth resonates.  People know it when they hear it and respond to it.  I was also driven by a sense of family mission, as my family has contributed significantly to Hollywood and somehow got passed over.  It grabbed me at a gut level, and one might say I became obsessively focused on getting this little bit of truth validated and placed correctly in context in historical archives.  

Now, here's where I'm a little miffed.  The publisher was clear this was a reference book, and renamed my darling project that was called "My dear Sol" to... that long reference title it's currently called.  Everybody was happy and satisfied, but was I?  No. I really think the book has a much broader appeal from a multitude of perspectives and was not ready to stop until I did everything I could to communicate that the book is not only educational, it's relevant to today's economy, interesting psychologically, has great potential for film and exposé, and it's darn fun reading! 

My family believes in education.  I was given an opportunity to right a historical wrong and learn as much as I possibly could about the world of book publishing and promotion.  I am like my Uncle Sol in many respects, including multi-talents and the need to work every talent I've been given.

How has the film industry changed-- or not changed-- since these letters were written?  

Technologically, of course, things have changed.  Salaries have also advanced.  The attitude, from my perspective, seems the same, but I am not in the film industry professionally and am only surmising from what I see and hear from people I know in the industry.  It's still full of incredibly talented creative people and ruthless business. 

The correspondence reveals all of the behind-the-scenes drama that was occurring in the company at that time-- employees stealing raw film, tempermental stars asking for advances for their "mothers' operations" and then skipping town, etc.  Some of the confidential letters were even written in coded telegrams.  What anecdote from the book is your favorite?

I love how my uncle kept taking that nastiness of Fox's and transmuting it into positive expression.  I relate to that aptitude.  The story I like is how Wurtzel is getting trashed by Fox for lending Tom Mix $2500, and Mix is getting nasty to work with for being indulged.  But because of his top box drawing ability, Uncle Sol is stuck with a nasty boss and actor, so he starts grooming another actor, Buck Jones, to compete against Tom Mix.  He put a great deal of passion into producing Buck Jones' first movie, so of course, Fox responds with one of his most negative reviews in the book, ordering the director fired immediately.  I was surprised he did not nip the strategy of creating competition for Tom Mix to completely undermine Wurtzel... but he didn't.  Wurtzel scouts again and discovers a brilliant 25 year-old director with immense talent; John Ford.  John Ford went on to produce 50 films for the company and earn four Academy Awards. Hurray Uncle Sol!

What became of William Fox and Sol Wertzel?  

By 1929, Fox was the wealthiest and most influential force in Hollywood, worth over $300 million.  About that time, he was forced out of his own company.  There was a big battle over the rights to sound; he had a monopoly and his enemies didn't like that.  Scott Eyman's book, "The Speed of Sound," covers that.  I believe Fox ended up in jail for a while for income tax evasion, but still came out of it all a rich man.

Wurtzel continued to work through all the transitions, including the Darryl Zannuck era.  He made his "B" rated money-making films.  He also hired directors and actors who had fallen on hard times and gave them breaks which made lifetime careers.  

In 1926, when the studio was well established, Sol and a few other executive friends established Temple Israel of Hollywood.  Sol was the first president for four years.  The desire to serve the community was strong and the Temple became a vehicle for feeding the poor.   I just attended the 75th anniversary of the Temple, and boy does it have a history of greatness... including Sammy Davis Jr. as a member.  

Sol retired from the studio in 1946 when they were getting ready to replace him.  He started his own production company, produced 18 films, retired in 1950 and died in 1956 of a stroke.  His son Paul, who is 80, is still alive, cantankerous, and living in Hollywood today.  He is very proud of me.
   
What lessons can screenwriters pick up from this book?  

I am a small business person, so tips I pulled are business oriented:

    1.  Have focus and intention - Create a game plan, put it on paper.
    2.  Create alliances - with people whose intention harmonizes with your own.
    3.  Be quality conscious - decide what quality entails.  For the Fox Films, a good story, director and box office star.
    4.  Work economically and efficiently- Don't lose sight of the bottom line.
    5.  Cut the dead weight -  Be willing to fire unessential dead weight.
    6.  Work for the company's best interest.
    7.  Utilize family and friends.
    8.  Put in the hours.
    9.  Delegate responsibility, but keep a tight rein.
    10.  Be diplomatic and do things in a sane manner.

There is a section in the book devoted to an impassioned scenario writer by the name of Marc Robbins.  He took an opportunity to vent his frustration to the press and described "the tortuous metamorphosis of a good script into a mediocrity."  It cost him his job... immediately.

Perhaps the best advice to any artist who wants to be commercially applied would be to not hold one's creation as sacred, but just as a vehicle for making a living.  If one cannot stand to have their work be edited, mutated, adjusted, or even mutilated, one should stay clear of trying to exploit their writing talent commercially and try to make money some other way and keep intact their soul, heart and passion.

BUY THE BOOK HERE.  

Read Absolute Write's book review of William Fox, Sol M. Wurtzel and the Early Fox Film Corporation by clicking here. 
   
Visit Carla's website at www.c-winternet.com.

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