Wolf Hall by Hilary Mantel - Great book with a big problem

Doc

Benefactor Member
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
122
Reaction score
7
Location
San Diego
I'm reading the Man Booker prize winner Wolf Hall by Hilary Mantel. I love it because it deals with the Tudor period, one of my favorites, and it focuses on Thomas Cromwell and Wolsey with few face to face meetings with over-exposed Henry and Anne in literary works. I hate it because it's a hard read only because the writer uses pronouns without discrimination. By that I mean if two or three males are in a scene, I have to reread to determine who is the antecedant of the he and exactly who is the subject of the conversation. Has anyone else reading this superb novel, with breathtakingly evocative metaphores this same problem.? It's a big novel, but worth every hour it takes to read it to the end --my opinion with the pronoun confusion its only draw back. I'd love to hear from someone finding the same problem. Or am I too critical? Doc
 

gothicangel

Toughen up.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 29, 2008
Messages
7,907
Reaction score
691
Location
North of the Wall
Wolf Hall

Has anyone else read this one yet?

I love my literary fiction, but I'm really struggling with this one.

Is it just me, or did anyone else find it difficult?
 

cuddlekins

...
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 9, 2009
Messages
154
Reaction score
4
Location
New Forest.
Difficult? Well slow and boring. I haven't finished reading it yet. And I love LF too.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
47,985
Reaction score
13,245
I tried, got around 30 pages into it and gave up.

It's a shitstorm of pronouns and it made one of the most fascinating periods of English history boring.
 

aadams73

A Work in Progress
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
9,901
Reaction score
6,428
Location
Oregon
Holy hell, I was worried it was just me! I should have loved this book( the Tudors intrigue me) but instead I'm seriously struggling. I keep picking it up and putting it back down again.

Glad to know I'm not alone.
 
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
47,985
Reaction score
13,245
I'm gonna stick to my Tudors box set.

Complete wank when it comes to historical inaccuracy but JRM takes his clothes off a lot.
 

Libbie

Worst song played on ugliest guitar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 23, 2007
Messages
5,309
Reaction score
1,094
Location
umber and black Humberland
I tried to start it, but I'm afraid the style isn't to my taste. Very glad it won the Booker, though. Gives a little more "cred" to historical fiction.

Though, I admit I haven't read any of the other books nominated for the Booker that time around (yet.) Maybe something else was more deserving.
 

timewaster

present
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 7, 2008
Messages
1,472
Reaction score
113
Location
Richmond UK
Have to say I loved it and read it as straight through as was possible given its size. I loved its immersive quality, the fact that it took me somewhere else. I got lost in it for a good long while.
 

angeliz2k

never mind the shorty
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 24, 2008
Messages
3,727
Reaction score
488
Location
Commonwealth of Virginia--it's for lovers
Website
www.elizabethhuhn.com
I read it and enjoyed it a lot, but I was also massively irritated by a lot of things--for instance, the pronouns. Just tell me who the hell is speaking, Hilary Mantel. And I'm amazed anyone could get very far without having an intricate knowledge of Tudor history--there are so many in jokes and people who pop up but aren't explained. Still, I stuck with it to the end and really liked it.

I wrote a nice, long reaction to it here:

http://queensransom.wordpress.com/2010/01/19/wolf-hall-reactions/
 

gothicangel

Toughen up.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 29, 2008
Messages
7,907
Reaction score
691
Location
North of the Wall
I read it and enjoyed it a lot, but I was also massively irritated by a lot of things--for instance, the pronouns. Just tell me who the hell is speaking, Hilary Mantel. And I'm amazed anyone could get very far without having an intricate knowledge of Tudor history--there are so many in jokes and people who pop up but aren't explained. Still, I stuck with it to the end and really liked it.

I wrote a nice, long reaction to it here:

http://queensransom.wordpress.com/2010/01/19/wolf-hall-reactions/

Thanks, I'll have a read.

I think once something starts irritating me, the critical part of my brain kicks in.
 

lkp

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
1,263
Reaction score
256
I loved it. One of the best historical novels I have read in years. I thought her period sense was impeccable and her revision of Cromwell's character was both fascinating and justified by evidence. I loved her novel about the French Revolution too.
 

Mad Queen

California Mountain Snake
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 5, 2008
Messages
676
Reaction score
122
I'm currently reading it, not getting any of the Tudor in-jokes, irritated at the pronouns, but enjoying it a lot. I love the characters, her style (apart from the pronouns) and the jokes I can understand. It took a while for the story to suck me in, but it was worth it.
 

mccardey

Self-Ban
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 10, 2010
Messages
19,212
Reaction score
15,820
Location
Australia.
"Wolf Hall" - Hilary Mantel

Is anyone else reading "Wolf Hall" and loving it to absolute bits?

I don't want it to end....
 
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
47,985
Reaction score
13,245
I've tried twice to get through it and would like to know how the hell Mantel manages to bore me with one of my favourite periods of English history?

Oh, I know - probably something to do with overuse of third person personal pronouns, necessitating constant backtracking to find out who the hell she's referring to.
 

mccardey

Self-Ban
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 10, 2010
Messages
19,212
Reaction score
15,820
Location
Australia.
I've tried twice to get through it and would like to know how the hell Mantel manages to bore me with one of my favourite periods of English history?

Oh, I know - probably something to do with overuse of third person personal pronouns, necessitating constant backtracking to find out who the hell she's referring to.


"Him" is Cromwell. Most of the time ;)
 
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
47,985
Reaction score
13,245
No, really. It isn't. 'He' refers to whichever person Mantel last named (as far as I can tell) and it jumps from Cromwell to Wolsey to who-the-hell-else she features in the damn book.

I can't figure out how this won the Booker.
 

mccardey

Self-Ban
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 10, 2010
Messages
19,212
Reaction score
15,820
Location
Australia.
You're a hard woman, Scarlet... I'll grant you teensy bit of toing and froing, but I'm loving it. And He is mostly Cromwell. At least - if you assume He = Cromwell, there's much less to-age and fro-age...

Admittedly, it doesn't help that everyone else in the book was named Mary. Or, you know, Thomas.
 
Last edited:

cooeedownunder

Grateful for the day
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
15,285
Reaction score
5,627
Age
57
Location
Australia
Website
www.australianflavour.net
I loved it. Love the opening especially, and the writing. I don't know if it deserved to win the Booker because I have never read, if anything, its competition. But I loved it and I read a few scenes again, but only because I thought it was written so well.
 

Purple Rose

practical experience, FTW
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 17, 2011
Messages
2,129
Reaction score
963
Website
alxblog.net
Agree with Scarlet Peaches but it was a minor annoyance for me. The story and the writing more than made up for it. I really LOVED, and couldn't put it down. At least not until I re-read certain parts to be clear about what was going on. Hard to resist anything to do with Cromwell especially with brilliant dialogue.
 

mccardey

Self-Ban
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 10, 2010
Messages
19,212
Reaction score
15,820
Location
Australia.
I'd never read Mantel before - as soon as I finish this I'll have to go and read everything else she's ever written. Suggestions, in order of stonkingly goodness?