Creative Writing Teacher Gets Canned

[Undercover]

Dope peddling Jesus. I'm not Christian, and that sounds right up my alley.

It sounds right up my alley too...and I'm a Catholic. lol

 

[Helix]

It fits right in with that water into wine business at Cana.

 

[Phaeal]

This is the kind of idiocy that makes me want to check into another planet.

If people want to see how hilariously transgressive teen writing can get, they ought to check out fan fic. Jesus and pot? Ho hum.

Offended and offending school district, why don't you just get rid of writing classes, and art, and music, and dance, and all that creative Bohemian stuff that's just a slick slide into free-thinking and DECADENCE! And pot, of course.

 

[Rhoda Nightingale]

Sooooo, it's been a while since high school, and I don't know exactly how this class is structured, but am I misunderstanding what "peer review" means? I'm picturing a classroom with desks clustered into small groups where students read each others' work and comment on it; or a one-at-a-time reading in front of the whole class which is then commented on; but I'm getting the impression just based on my own experience in creative writing classes that the teacher wouldn't know exactly what each student wrote until this "peer review" event happened. What is the scenario exactly? And why is any of it the teacher's "fault" even though she's obviously not bothered by dope-peddling Jesus?

I'm also surprised no one's has theorized that the student who wrote the offending story might've been a fan of this show.

 

[cmhbob]

It's a public school system, not a private, AFAICT, and she's well thought of by some students, according to this Tumblr. She's also published. There's not much written about this, unfortunately. I have to think there's way more to the story.

Ah! Here's a more in-depth piece: http://www.abqjournal.com/508047/news/rr-teacher-ends-up-resigning-after-student-complaint.html Apparently it wasn't really the story itself, but the peer review process. The Offended Student was the one who had to read story aloud for the peer review process. They wanted her to drop peer review from her classes.

All I can think of in stories like this is that I think a LOT of my friends, Christian and non-Christian, are going to be very surprised about who ends up where. Cf "sheep and goats."

 

[Locke]

Freedom of speech only means you can say aloud what you choose to say - it does not mean freedom from being held responsible or accountable for what you choose to say.

Precisely.

Mandatory XKCD (I'd post the image but it's sort of large).

 

[LeslieB]

It's a public school system, not a private, AFAICT, and she's well thought of by some students, according to this Tumblr. She's also published. There's not much written about this, unfortunately. I have to think there's way more to the story.

Ah! Here's a more in-depth piece: http://www.abqjournal.com/508047/news/rr-teacher-ends-up-resigning-after-student-complaint.html Apparently it wasn't really the story itself, but the peer review process. The Offended Student was the one who had to read story aloud for the peer review process. They wanted her to drop peer review from her classes.

All I can think of in stories like this is that I think a LOT of my friends, Christian and non-Christian, are going to be very surprised about who ends up where. Cf "sheep and goats."

If this was the regular procedure in this class, then that puts a different angle on things. I think it is entirely possible that the student wrote that story for the sole purpose of making one of their classmates angry or uncomfortable by having to read something they found offensive out loud.

 

[Shadow_Ferret]

I believe it was Jesus who said, "Dope will get you through times of no money, better than money will get you through times of no dope."

 

[Lillith1991]

If this was the regular procedure in this class, then that puts a different angle on things. I think it is entirely possible that the student wrote that story for the sole purpose of making one of their classmates angry or uncomfortable by having to read something they found offensive out loud.

I don't see how it does. Without a crap ton more information it still looks like she is being punished for something a STUDENT did, as if she had forced the student to write said offensive story for the express purpose of using them to pick on her other students.

 

[Fruitbat]

We've seen so many stories like this on here, and most of the time we find out that the one side we heard didn't tell the whole story.

When school administrators get a complaint about a teacher that they believe warrants investigation, they need to investigate, whether the teacher in question likes it or not. Obviously, they suspect something's up. They might be a pack of mean idiots, or the issue may not be what the teacher is saying it is. They are under district rules and can't say anything they want to the press like a teacher who no longer works for them can.

If the administrators allowed the teacher back into the classroom before they had a chance to get to the bottom of it and it turns out to be worst case scenario, they could (rightfully) lose their jobs and the district be sued. So the teacher is put on (paid) leave until their investigation is complete.

It doesn't imply guilt and it isn't a punishment. It's standard procedure. Nothing has been determined yet because they haven't finished investigating yet.

Instead of waiting, the teacher quits and goes to the press with her side of events, which, of course, could be true. Or could be a pre-emptive strike because she knows more than she's saying and hopes that getting the public on her side will make the school district drop the whole thing. Or some other combination.

The teacher does not say exactly what this alleged pressure to resign was, from what I read. Why be vague now? It's not a fact that she was pressured to resign but just one side, which the other side denies.

Also, even if a child did misbehave, it's very unprofessional for an adult in charge to go tell the press that a child snitched on her and a child is out to get her and to blame for the whole incident. Why not wait until the investigation is complete and give the school administrators a chance to discipline the child if that's the case?

I don't know but as a former teacher, there are a few red flags to me and it looks a little fishy. We shall see...

 

[Ken]

Also, even if a child did misbehave, it's unprofessional for an adult in charge to go tell the press that a child snitched on her and a child is out to get her and to blame for the whole incident.

I don't know but as a former teacher, there are a few red flags to me and it looks a little fishy. We shall see...

You've got a point there. It does seem a bit off for her to have done that. Then again she's on the defensive with a career at stake. Still --

 

[cmhbob]

I'm wondering at this point if the Offended Student asked to not read the story. Pure speculation: Writing Student wrote the Jesus/dope story (which I'd really like to read, honestly), hoping for the Offended Student to either have to listen to it or even better, have to read it. Offended Student got the story, realized what it was about, and asked to not have to read it. Teacher said no, you've got to read it. Things went down hill from there.

Peer review I don't think is a bad thing. But I'd hate to have someone else read my writing out loud for a crit group. If it's going to be reviewed, I want to be the one to read it out loud, so I can read it the way I wrote it.

 

[LeslieB]

I don't see how it does. Without a crap ton more information it still looks like she is being punished for something a STUDENT did, as if she had forced the student to write said offensive story for the express purpose of using them to pick on her other students.

I agree that there are a lot of unknowns, but I'm not ready to give her a total pass yet. And I agree that thinking the teacher forced the student to write the story they did is silly. However, she could have had a classroom environment that allowed or even encouraged it.

Maybe it's because I have very little rose-coloring on my glasses when I look back at my school days, but I can think of a number of reasons the teacher's actions could have played a part. I've seen too many teacher's pets who tormented other students and were never punished, too many classes where the teacher disliked a student and made no secret of it so they were the target of the whole class, etc. This incident may just be the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back.

I'm firmly in the 'we aren't being told everything' crowd. The teacher could be, as some seem to think, a victim of over-zealous administrators. Or she could have a serious problem in the way she runs a classroom. We just don't know at this point.

 

[Lillith1991]

I agree that there are a lot of unknowns, but I'm not ready to give her a total pass yet. And I agree that thinking the teacher forced the student to write the story they did is silly. However, she could have had a classroom environment that allowed or even encouraged it.

Maybe it's because I have very little rose-coloring on my glasses when I look back at my school days, but I can think of a number of reasons the teacher's actions could have played a part. I've seen too many teacher's pets who tormented other students and were never punished, too many classes where the teacher disliked a student and made no secret of it so they were the target of the whole class, etc. This incident may just be the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back.

I'm firmly in the 'we aren't being told everything' crowd. The teacher could be, as some seem to think, a victim of over-zealous administrators. Or she could have a serious problem in the way she runs a classroom. We just don't know at this point.

I'm not giving the teacher a pass at all. If it comes out they contributed in some way by providing an enviorment where something like this is common enough to cause said offended student to complain for a just reason, then I'm fine with them being canned. But if they say, just told the student to read it and then see them after class to talk about why it upset them. Well, then I don't see what is wrong with that. Life isn't comfortable, and highschool is a particularly uncomfortable time. It's supposed to be about social learning as well as academic learning.

Then again, the schools reaction is coming across as bullying and that doesn't sit right with me. I can't say the teacher's response to being asked to change her curiculum for such a student is appropriate either, but I do think it never should've got so far that she was essentially forced out. They should have made a waiver madatory for the class or something along those lines if peer review is such a problem. Students that have the slip participate in the review and those who don't aren't forced to. Simple.

 

[Fruitbat]

Ah, okay. I couldn't get through to the article cmhbob linked earlier but I just did and it explains more.

Apparently the investigation was over what sounds like an ongoing lack of professionalism in the classroom (and possibly extending to outside the classroom as well), not just that one incident, whatever it was, exactly.

The investigation was concluded and she was invited back, with instructions to change a couple of things and not tell the students why she was gone.

She told the students why she was gone anyway and possibly didn't do other things they had told her to do(?). While she didn't call out the student who told her parents by name, she did tell the students another student caused it. That's a strange attitude, in my opinion. Students are children and should tell their parents if they don't think something is right. Her attitude that she was snitched on makes her seem like a peer, not a teacher. IF they found problems, then that's the issue, not that a child told on her.

She also apparently had a lot of dual relationships with students, both FB friends and possibly in the community, too. That was frowned on in my district but I'm not sure if it was expressly against the rules. But if it caused any problems, you would be held responsible.

The principal gave her another chance in spite of going against a direct order, and said the teacher needed to write up a plan of how she would address the problems noted. The teacher didn't want to do things the way her boss wanted them done, so she quit instead and then went to the press.

I think she may be confused about the difference between a popular opinion rally and a job. Any job I've ever had, the boss makes the rules and you follow them, unless they're illegal or immoral or something else that is far beyond just not being what you would rather do. Quitting in the middle of the year, breaking her contract, is an additional lack of professionalism. It's a giant no-no in education. She says she wants to get another teaching job but I don't expect she'll be in high demand. *shrug*

 

[CrastersBabies]

Peer review is extremely common in college writing classes. I'm not sure about high school, though.

Based on what's available for public consumption, I feel that the school (and student who made this an issue) is in the wrong. But I honestly don't know.

I would allow this story in my college writing classroom. But, if another student said, "Hey, I don't feel comfortable being in this peer review group because I'm a Christian and this is really disgusting to me," it's a matter of switching that student to another group and calling it a day.

If someone wrote a sex scene and another student didn't feel comfortable peer-reviewing that, same thing. Switch people around. Same with violence or whatnot. The give and take here is that when you allow anything to be written in a writing class, you're going to have to navigate the waters when others get a bit "put off" by it. Which I don't mind. I pretty much allow for anything (barring straight-up Penthouse style porn).

Any professional is going to judge this on a case-by-case basis.

If a student simply didn't "like" the peer review process, then that's another matter. Unless they have some sort of severe mental issue happening that will inflate negatively because of peer review, it would simply be a, "Do it or don't. But you won't get credit for this if you bow out."

Again, circumstances will matter, I'm sure.

Reading that one of the students might have said that they wanted to get this person fired is troubling, though.

 

[Fruitbat]

ETA: Ugh, forget it. I tried to copy and paste an article but it kept getting messed up. The link cmhbob mentioned on post #30 works now if anyone wants to read more...

When I taught, we couldn't let students swap papers and grade each other's papers because of student confidentiality laws, which wouldn't apply in college. So having to allow them to opt out of the sharing might be something to do with that.

But the article says the problem, according to the administration, was not all that but an overall lack of professionalism. And after reading a few of the things she does admit to (blaming a student, breaking a direct order not to tell the students why she had been gone, breaking her contract in the middle of the year, dual relationships with students outside of school) I have to say I agree.

 

[Fruitbat]

Here's another example of something that's considered very unprofessional in the field when you work with children - having a poem published under your real name that any student can find right away by googling your name that starts like this:

The last time we were in this place
we fucked like animals.

It was the bathroom of an
overly crowded hotel room.
A five by eight rectangle of privacy,
and a shower with a rickety rod
I didn’t trust to hold my grip.

http://gravelmagazine.wix.com/gravel#!katrina-guarascio/cjv7

She may just be in the wrong field. The public school districts aren't known for their appreciation of renegades shaking it up and doing their own thing, lol.

 

[Fruitbat]

And now I see she and I are published in the same places. Nevermind then, she can do no wrong!

 

[frimble3]

There's really not enough information to judge. There could be so many variables. on both sides. But (the judging-on-not-enough-information begins):

But Guarascio said her students were never forced to read each other’s work and they could always choose whether to do so.

'Choosing' not to do what the teacher says can be problematic. Especially if it's been presented as a normal part of the class, and, as it was October, I assume that there had been previous peer-reviews. There are ways of reminding the class that no-one is forced to read another's work, and that one can choose not to, that both draws attention to the choice, and labels the chooser as, well, not one of 'us'.
At the same time, unless you're watching your students, the very act of giving this choice can give another student a head's up that there's a potential target in the room.
There are ways to imply that one person's religious book is another's 'classic tale', ways that a teacher can suggest that being radical, and irreverent are laudable goals, which can easily be subverted to 'hassle the conservative and reverent'. Sometimes this is done in the name of 'honesty', and sometimes in the name of 'freedom'.

After initially refusing, Guarascio did tell students why she’d been gone but did so without identifying the student who complained, she said.

And, in a classroom with a limited number of suspects, all of whom know each other, how hard was it to identify the complaining student? Probably took all of about 5 minutes.

I don't find it hard to visualize a dynamic whereby a teacher, going for the 'cool teacher' prize, lets students get out of hand, or where students, playing up to a 'cool' teacher, push the envelope until someone's in tears.

 

[Captcha]

I'm with Fruitbat. This woman sounds unprofessional in a variety of ways. And maybe she recognized that, since she quit.

 

[Liosse de Velishaf]

It seems like she was being unprofessional and that's why she got fired. She may honestly believe that's not it, though.


I don't have any issue with her publishing risque poems under her real name, or the general structure of her peer review process-assuming she did offer the option of not reading or swapping groups. Or with her dual relationships.


What does bother me is saying why she was removed to students. That creates a dynamic of setting students against each other for personal reasons, and I don't like that. Mostly because she is in a position of power.

 

[Samsonet]

I'd hate to be either of the students mentioned here...

 

[ajaye]

What does bother me is saying why she was removed to students. That creates a dynamic of setting students against each other for personal reasons, and I don't like that. Mostly because she is in a position of power.

This is how I feel too, especially when she was told not to. ETA but that's the only problem I have with the teacher's behaviour.

Do we know that the students read the stories aloud? I didn't actually see that stated, though I could have missed it. I just saw that they read each other's work in the peer review process.

 

[Ken]

And now I see she and I are published in the same places. Nevermind then, she can do no wrong!

As soon as it was mentioned she was a writer I became sympathetic. (Guess that's not too surprising about her being a writer given she teaches writing; lol.) Even if she's rather wrong here and brought this on herself I wish her well. She'll need some luck.

Creative writing jobs aren't easy to come by, going by what members on AW have said in the past. "Not just a matter of getting a degree and sending out a resume."