Pros and Cons of using writing software

backspacebutton · Oct 13, 2006

Anybody use novel writing software? (merged)

I have a hard time keeping up with my characters, particularly when I put one book down and start working on another (when I get bored).

Do you guys use novel writing software that you can recommend?

I'm thinking that there might be something that can help me keep up with characters, chapters, submissions, etc.

Anyone want to recommend a product?

Siddow · Oct 13, 2006

Excel. (for submission sheets, and character work)

Word. (use Document Map to quickly navigate through chapters)

Carrie in PA · Oct 13, 2006

Here's a thread that you might find helpful. And welcome!

I use Word and a stack of index cards.

blacbird · Oct 13, 2006

backspacebutton said:
I have a hard time keeping up with my characters, particularly when I put one book down and start working on another (when I get bored).

If you have a hard time keeping up with your characters, how can you expect a reader to? Strikes me as something not curable through software.

caw.

backspacebutton · Oct 13, 2006

Thanks for the welcome!

Siddow · Oct 13, 2006

backspacebutton said:
Thanks for the welcome!

Ahem...

Welcome!

(warmth can be found on the newbies board. Sorry, I didn't notice!)

backspacebutton · Oct 13, 2006

I don't know why I didn't think of document map! Thanks for the suggestion.

emeraldcite · Oct 13, 2006

blacbird said:
If you have a hard time keeping up with your characters, how can you expect a reader to? Strikes me as something not curable through software.

caw.

I'm sure that those who write epic fantasies involving tons of characters have to keep track of them some way.

Even big named authors have trouble keeping track and have to go to their fans, albeit anonymously[FONT=&quot], in order to "remember" who these characters are...

Take George RR Martin, for example:

GalleyCat said:

In the morning, she convened a group of fantasy writers, including NYTR.A. Salvatore and George R. R. Martin, to discuss the future of epic fantasy—joking about the sheer immenseness of Martin's four-books-and-counting series, Salvatore quipped, "Do you have a whiteboard that takes up a wall of your house to keep all your characters straight?" No, Martin joked back, he lets the people who run his unofficial fan site sort all that out, then emails them when he needs to check up on a character's details. Salvatore admitted to a similar strategy for one book which brought a supporting character in his series to the foreground. Having lost track of that character's weapons inventory, he posted anonymously to one of his fan boards, asking what the character had and what it did, and pretty soon the readers had come up with pages' worth of material.

Click to expand...

I'd say Martin could use a program to track all that.

I'm sure even Tolkien had a system to keep track of names. For some people, programs work great; for others, a notebook or index cards are just peachy.

[/FONT]

K_Woods · Oct 13, 2006

The only software I use is RoughDraft.

Probably not what you're looking for, though.

Dawno · Oct 13, 2006

Our own Fahim has a nifty little tool called Plot Craft - visit his site to download. he hangs out at the Tech forum here, as well as the Blogging forum. He's one of the moderators, too.

Button · Oct 13, 2006

I use writing software as an excuse to procrastinate when I'm supposed to be writing. (I love software and playing with it, doesn't matter what it is for.)

I'm like others, I use Word. I'm too used to it to change now.

And after several novels, I still have problems keeping up with eye color, hair color, usually of the minor characters. Sometimes I swap cars they drive, that sort of thing. (One minute it's a rusty station wagon, the next it's a blue sedan.)

It happens. With so many chapters and all that and if you are novel swapping while writing (I do it too) it can be tougher. I should keep notes.

I am horrible about that. I do have stacks of index cards I don't use... I'm horrible about keeping up with Excel sheets. I tend to not worry about keeping up with that sort of thing until it comes down to the editing phase.

vetinari · Oct 13, 2006

I have notes in three different places, and a reference copy with a ton of sticky tabs to point at important things like new people.

And I still lost two people somewhere.

Dawno · Oct 13, 2006

backspacebutton - I'm sorry I forgot to say above: "welcome to AW!" I hope you're finding a lot of answers to your writing questions. Don't forget to read our Newbies Guide (there's a link at the top of each page)

You can also PM any one with a Moderator or SuperModerator title if you get really stuck. Most folk here are very helpful - but as Dama mentioned there's not much new under the sun, so very often your question has been asked and answered before - try the forum search function and if you can't find the answers then, please feel free to post here or in the Roundtable section or on the Tech Help threads (this question is sorta Novel-y and Tech-y)

Gwenzilla · Oct 13, 2006

I use WriteItNow, and I like it for the most part because it organises things in chapters, has spiffy event charts I can play with when bored, and shows several sentences in one window when I do a global find on something or other. WriteItNow is not perfect, but it is a powerful word processor, does provide word counts and readability scores, exports into rtf, text, and html, and provides a submissions log in the same application, so you don't have to open up two or three apps to keep your timelines and administrative stuff straight: it's all right there, managed on a per-projecct basis.

Unlike most of the people who are responding here, I will do nearly anything to avoid using M$Word. For a general word processor on my computer, I use NeoOffice, which is built on OpenOffice, an open-source (and free) suite of applications that do everything most big-budget software does, plus takes up less space on my hard drive.

Dario D. · Oct 13, 2006

Carrie in PA said:
Here's a thread that you might find helpful. And welcome!

I use Word and a stack of index cards.

Thanks for posting my link

- Yeah, I was going to say that Book Writer is what I use, and I highly recommend it.

kplowright · Oct 14, 2006

Hi,

Yes, I suffer the same problem with characters, especially foreign names. I use a white board and print out timelines on A3 spread sheets relating to each character input. You can download my book to understand why: http://www.vostokstation.com.au/vostok_station_ebook.pdf

I'm now writing two more books based on the same characters, but I introduce an even wider cast, as the real world does. Ahhhh!!!!

kplowright · Oct 14, 2006

Following up, I use MS word. I owned a software development company for over a decade (Largest supplier of SME ecommerce software in australia). I tried other stuff but it always made it harder in the end. Create character sheets and timelines. But I reommend nothing else other than MS word, because when you hit the agents and publishers, make sure you are using industry standards. Hope this helps. (My company also published magazines etc)

kplowright · Oct 14, 2006

Hehehehe, love that. I had some absolute gems of mistakes that made me blush reading them. You would go, how the!@#$%...... You know what I mean. My specialist readers are unforgiving, defence analysts..picky, picky, picky, but almost always right dammit.

Jamesaritchie · Oct 14, 2006

software

Yes, I use MS Word. If you want to keep track of characters, it isn't that difficult, and certainly doesn't require any special software. You just make a list, which is really all any of the expensive software allows you to do, anyway.

I think there's a pretty good reason why so few pro writers use so-called "writing software." I'm sure there are a couple out there who do, but the only pro writers I've ever known who used writing software are those who make money off the sales of the software.

Having said that, there are two types of "writing software." The kind that is really just for organization, and the kind that supposedly helpes you write a novel by offering plot tips, character tips, etc. If you use this latter type, good luck. I doubt you'll ever sell anything to anyone.

I suppose the organization type might be useful for some, but in all honesty, I haven't seen any of it that woorks any better for organization than MS Word, or any other good word processor. Most of it doesn't work nearly as well.

It's been my experience that if you can't write a salable novel without such software, you doubly can't write a salable novel with it. I think most such software is no more than a writer looking for a magic bullet, and there aren't any.

I also thnk most such software should be called "transfer software." It's real purpose is to transfer money form teh pocket of the writer to the pocket of the software owner.

spacejock2 · Oct 14, 2006

I use writing software to help me keep things on track while I'm putting novels together. I'm also a published science fiction author, although I wouldn't be game to call myself a pro just yet.

I'm sure I said this in the other thread, but what I don't like about a regular word processor is the way you have one huge file OR a series of chapter files. I could never find a quick way to do the following no matter which method I chose:

Move scene 2 from chapter 18 (or was it 16?) to the middle of chapter 8.

Move chapter 9 after chapter 11, then shift 20 to 18, 7 before 5, and move 6 to the end of chapter 12 (which is a combination of chapters 8 and 10) Then fix all the chapter headings automatically with a mouse click. (Two days of that in Word and I don't remember a thing about the damn book. In the writing software I can see the scene headings at a glance when I click the chapters.)

Maintain notes for each scene - short and long descriptions - and be able to (a) print the project without them and (b) print one or both sets of notes in synopsis OR summary format.

Globally replace the name of a character or location across the whole novel. (Difficult when you have 30+ individual chapter files.)

Page through nine chapters checking the last scene in each one ends with some kind of hook.

Generate a list showing the number of viewpoint scenes per character.

Show all the unique words in your novel counted from most to least used.

Etc etc.

I'm not saying it's impossible to write a novel in a regular word processor, because it is obviously IS possible. What I'm pointing out is that writing software can help with the mechanics. Word processors were originally designed to type up the occasional business letter on the new-fangled computer thing, not to hold 80,000+ words of fiction while the author's brain struggled to hold every organisational aspect.

Yes, word processors have document maps and so on. None of them go anywhere near far enough, in my opinion.

spacejock2 · Oct 14, 2006

By the way, I'd guess that most of the current crop of 'pro' authors are in their fifties or sixties. Not surprising, given it can take 10-20 years to get published and then establish yourself.

So, they weren't exactly born with a mouse in their hand, and I'm guessing the next crop of writers will have been using computers from a much younger age.

aadams73 · Oct 14, 2006

Carrie in PA said:
I use Word and a stack of index cards.

Same tools I use. Oh, and I use Post Its.

Fahim · Oct 14, 2006

I agree with Simon (spacejock2)

Sure, you can write without novel writing software. Heck, you can write without a word processor

But the point is that if you have the technology, you should be able to exploit it to the fullest and we aren't - not with word processors when it comes to writing a novel. We don't use half the features in a word processor in writing a novel - I mean the features that would be useful to us, not the fluff. But there's a lot more that's missing from a word processor that can be useful for writers when working with a large manuscript.

I know that Simon's got his own software, yWriter, which does some (all?) of the things he mentioned. I've also written an application of my own (which I haven't released) so that I could write the way I want to, not the way my word processor says I must

I know there are other apps out there which try to help a writer write better, be more organized. The issue usually is that most people don't know about these different applications and what they offer. Perhaps none of them are for you but it helps to know what is out there and to be able to make an informed decision as to whether the software might help you or not. This is where we need a list of all the different writing software out there so that we can point people to. Anybody willing to start such a list?

Actually, that might be a good sticky for either here or for the Tech Help forum. I'll try to get started sometime tomorrow (it's bedtime here) if somebody doesn't beat me to it :tongue

Carrie in PA · Oct 14, 2006

aadams73 said:
Same tools I use. Oh, and I use Post Its.

Ooh yeah! Post Its!!! Oh, and a dry erase board. I guess I use more stuff than I thought.

Jamesaritchie · Oct 14, 2006

spacejock2 said:
I use writing software to help me keep things on track while I'm putting novels together. I'm also a published science fiction author, although I wouldn't be game to call myself a pro just yet.

I'm sure I said this in the other thread, but what I don't like about a regular word processor is the way you have one huge file OR a series of chapter files. I could never find a quick way to do the following no matter which method I chose:

Move scene 2 from chapter 18 (or was it 16?) to the middle of chapter 8.

Move chapter 9 after chapter 11, then shift 20 to 18, 7 before 5, and move 6 to the end of chapter 12 (which is a combination of chapters 8 and 10) Then fix all the chapter headings automatically with a mouse click. (Two days of that in Word and I don't remember a thing about the damn book. In the writing software I can see the scene headings at a glance when I click the chapters.)

Maintain notes for each scene - short and long descriptions - and be able to (a) print the project without them and (b) print one or both sets of notes in synopsis OR summary format.

Globally replace the name of a character or location across the whole novel. (Difficult when you have 30+ individual chapter files.)

Page through nine chapters checking the last scene in each one ends with some kind of hook.

Generate a list showing the number of viewpoint scenes per character.

Show all the unique words in your novel counted from most to least used.

Etc etc.

I'm not saying it's impossible to write a novel in a regular word processor, because it is obviously IS possible. What I'm pointing out is that writing software can help with the mechanics. Word processors were originally designed to type up the occasional business letter on the new-fangled computer thing, not to hold 80,000+ words of fiction while the author's brain struggled to hold every organisational aspect.

Yes, word processors have document maps and so on. None of them go anywhere near far enough, in my opinion.

Any of this can be done quickly and easily with either Word or Wordperfect, though some of it needs a macro or two. I don't know what word processors were orginally designed for, but I do know most of the best novels I've ever read were written in longhand, or with a typewriter.

Honestly, both word and WordPerfect will treat individual chapters as a single document, if you know how to go about it.

Then again, I have little right to talk. In all my years of writing, I've never once had to move scene two from chapter 18 to the middle of chapter 8. I honestly can't remember ever moving a scene from one chapter to another.

Maintaining notes for each scene is easy, and you don't have to print them, but since I don't use notes, it doesn't matter to me.

The last thing on earth I want is a list showing the number of viewpoint scenes per character. I'm afraid I'd take it seriously and actually do something like try to balance teh number of scenes.

I'm glad all this works for you, but I honestly don't see a single thing there that I can't do with either Word or WordPerfect. But, in truth, I don't see a single thing there I want to do, either.

Pros and Cons of using writing software

backspacebutton

Siddow

I'm super! Thanks for asking

Carrie in PA

Write All The Words!

blacbird

backspacebutton

Siddow

I'm super! Thanks for asking

backspacebutton

emeraldcite

Art is Resistance

K_Woods

9 of 10 Overlords prefer Evil Pie!

Dawno

Shiny!

Button

Resident in Question

vetinari

Dawno

Shiny!

Gwenzilla

Rarely a leaf on the wind

Dario D.

kplowright

kplowright

kplowright

Jamesaritchie

spacejock2

spacejock2

aadams73

A Work in Progress

Fahim

Mad coder, lazy writer

Carrie in PA

Write All The Words!

Jamesaritchie